AssemblyBoard

Hello, I'm not saying I'm related to these people but for some reason they were at the reunion,

   In the late 70's my aunt and her husband started listening to Kenneth Copeland. They really enjoyed his brand of the "prosperity" gospel, his Texas wit/charm.  They figured this was for them so my uncle became a minister  and started preaching Copeland's theology. Now how it happened that he became a minister I do not know. He didn't have any formal education other than reading the Bible and reading Copeland's materials. Every Friday night they would have a Bible study and follow it with a healing service. people would get healed!  People would get slain in the Spirit. (Falling down backwards and saying, Duh, duh, duh, duh........) O.K. I'm just getting started!  My aunt starts talking about wanting to have a baby girl. Now this is somewhat of a problem because her husband had his tubes tied. But she has found a way around this. She has learned through Copeland's theology that she can just "Name it! and Claim it!" In other words all she has to say is, "The Bible says, Seek the Lord with all your being and he will give you the desires of your heart!"  O.K. so her desire is to have this baby-girl!    For months this is all she talks about. "I'm going to have this baby girl!"  "The Lord said so!"  "Her name is ...."  "She is going-to be born on..." It gets better. Not only is she talking about it, she is acting on it! She is exercising faith!  She is buying clothes for it! She even had a baby shower! It wasn't hard for her to convince others around her she was pregnant because she started growing this big old pot belly!  She is wearing a pregnancy blouse, "Tax Deduction"



  Months passed by but no baby! She kept changing the date, "It will be born on such and such a day!"  Yet the date would come and go,  no such luck!   


  Did she ever come to her sanity? Did she ever admit she was acting like an idiot? No!  Although she is no longer pregnant (Thank God she is 70ish) she and her husband still preach Copeland's theology.  (but Praise the Lord they moved out of state!)

  Did I mention my aunt and uncle have 4 boys?  They all had the joy of living through this episode in their parent's life. The whole time this was going on my aunt is messing with their heads. Every day they are hearing what the Lord is telling their mother. Two of-them have been in and out of drug and alcohol rehab their whole lives. The other is on disability and the youngest is a retarded idiot.


  Did I mention that my aunt and uncle were able to con my grandparents out of 50 grand?  They were just going to borrow it to start a ministry in Kansas. The money was gone in two years and no ministry! This is due in part because the first thing they did after moving to Kansas was to buy a church building! They bought a church property and opened up shop!  They didn't have a congregation because God told them to just step out in faith!  So here is the situation they have a church and no congregation!  Unless you count the six people who wandered in off the street.


Now I'm not saying I'm related to these people I've only seen them on a few occasions, its been years really...

Oh.My!!! :o

I went to live with my Aunt when I was a teenager. (3 weeks) One afternoon I am stuck alone with her. We have to go grocery shopping. Before we go we are sitting in this old junky car. It's a really old, junky, cheap looking small economy car.  It looks as if only divine intervention would cause it to move. (can you see it coming?) Before she turns the ignition key she wants to pray. She wants to pray and she expects me to participate. (The magic works better this way.) Oh, I forgot to tell you before we pray she looks at me and says, "I never put any gasoline in this car!" "I never do anything to it!" "This car runs completely on God's provision!"  So we hold hands and close our eyes. She starts off, "Oh mighty powerful God in heaven, I thank you that all things are mine in Christ Jesus!" "I thank you that you have made me more than a conqueror through his blood! etc..."  After about 5 minutes of prayer we stop and open our eyes. We both are looking at the ignition. "Will God perform a miracle?" "Barummmmmmmmmm!" The car miraculously! Amazingly! Triumphantly starts up! And not only does it start up that engine sounds great! Its like they put a great engine inside this crappie looking car!  I am amazed at the power of God in my Aunt's life!



    O.K. looking back I was pretty stupid! gullible, naive, weak minded etc....   

My Aunt was and still is this sick *&^%$ who wants everyone to think that she has supernatural powers. That day in her car she had a captive audience. She thought to herself that she could mess with my head because....she had the right to do it?.......religion is her constitutional right?......she really can do magic?


  Whatever the reason its not justified in my book!  What gives anyone the right to do this sort of thing? To take a child and subject them to this sort of abuse is totally wrong!!!

 Did this sort of thing go on in the Assembly? Not on the same level but it did!


I mentioned before all of their kids have turned out to be total losers. they have been through multiple marriages, in and out of rehab.


   Now when I think about it, I am glad I didn't get married and have children in the Assembly!

Today I talked to an elderly Christian man who is associated with Kenneth Copeland. He went on and on about how Kenneth is just a simple honest man who is responsive to the Lord. Kenneth responded to the Lord when he bought a piece of land in Texas. He further responded to the Lord when the Lord told him to drill for oil! The Lord has continued to prosper Ken because Ken just responds! Ken has "found" lots of other commodities on his property. This is why he is so wealthy! Ken gives back to the Lord! Ken gives and gives and gives to the needs of the ministry as the Lord gives him wisdom. Sound familiar?

  The truth is Ken has gotten all of his money by convincing others around him that God has given him some sort of special mnistry. however, this man I talked to is totally convinced of Ken's honesty/sincerity. I think it is interesting that he started in with this Ken testimony without me really asking any questions. I think it is a script that Copleand constatly feeds to his followers and they in turn repeat it.


  I read somewhere that Copland has come under a lot of fire because he refuses to open up his accounts to scrutiny.

Ex-employees: Copeland ministry followers being misled
12:07 PM CST on Thursday, November 8, 2007

By BRETT SHIPP / WFAA-TV
Days after the announcement of a congressional investigation into the finances of Fort Worth televangelists Kenneth and Gloria Copeland, former ministry insiders say that Mr. Copeland's faithful followers are being misled.


WFAA-TV (Ch.8) first reported on the private use of the Copeland ministry's $20 million jet, trips made to a ski resort and exotic game hunting ranch. But the real turbulence for Mr. Copeland's ministry may come from within the gates of his Eagle Mountain Church and Ministry Headquarters north of Fort Worth.

Former employees told WFAA-TV that the Copelands one sees on television are not the same Copelands in real life.

Four former Copeland ministry employees said they were disappointed after seeing how the ministry operates.

Jeff Spradlin said he grew up admiring the Copelands and was excited to work for them. “Within 90 days, I started realizing this was a huge mistake," he said.

For nearly two years, Mr. Spradlin said he worked in the mail processing center where prayer request envelopes stuffed with cash would arrive. He said a group of ministers, not the Copelands, would pray over the unopened envelopes.

Mr. Spradlin said he and other mail processors were the ones who read the requests. “I was sitting there getting this paperwork all the day thinking, Kenneth and Gloria don't see a word of this," he said.

Another person who has worked with the ministry, Nathan Boutwell, said followers were being misled. "They think that when they get the letter back that someone has actually prayed,” he said.

Mr. Boutwell also said it was he, not Mr. Copeland, who read the prison ministry prayer requests.

"There was no actual human contact with that letter besides my eyes," he said. "But that's OK, Copeland gets 10,000 letters a week. But admit that. Don't imply that you read these personally when you don't."

Mr. Copeland told WFAA-TV he did pray over some of his requests but not over all of them due to the volume of mail. He said he had a prayer team pray over the requests when he couldn’t.

Former employees also said their spirits sank after learning the Copelands have little if any contact with staff.

"The one time I saw the man was at the Christmas party," Mr. Boutwell said.

Another former employee, Barbara Pierce, said workers were told to avoid the Copelands if they ever encountered them.

"It was an unwritten law that if Kenneth or Gloria walked into the office you don't see them, you don't speak to them," she said.

Former employees also said that when the Copelands weren't on the road, they spent their days inside their 18,000-square-foot parsonage on the shores of Eagle Mountain Lake, surrounded by hundreds of acres of range and ranch land not far from their tennis courts and boat house.

Mr. Copeland said he had little contact with his staff because he and Gloria were private people who were on the road preaching much of the time.

"You don't want to talk about the productive side of the ministry, you just want to run me down,” he told WFAA-TV. “You want to tear down everything you can, and I don't understand that."

http://www.kcm.org/index.php?p=home

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_Copeland

Dave/Vandyyke-----

All right all right all right all right all right already!

Can you say "forever stuck on the hairy underbellies of anything purporting to be Christian ministries"?

On a side note.......

I can hardly wait for your documentary to be published.  Be sure to run any parts of it that occurred between 1987-2003 by me to edit for facts and tone.   :-\ Make sure also to put in a disclaimer regarding errata.  :-\ I have read a number of items on this board and on the website that claimed to be 100% accurate but were not. :P

I hope your feelings do not get in the way of a quality production on the Geftakys assembly.

Matt Sciaini

Matt,

I think most of us would be interested on your thoughts on the "things that were supposed to be 100% accurate but were not."

Any examples you can share with us?

Tom Maddux

I know a few of the old leading brothers in various small Assemblies who met George and Betty but once. This site says that all LB's were trained and indoctrinated by George and Betty themselves. That wasn't 100% accurate.

All right all right all right all right all right already!

                                        Quote from Matt


    I am always amused at the assertion you are being forced to read my posts. 



Matt, you are a one-of-a-kind gem!



   

I know a few of the old leading brothers in various small Assemblies who met George and Betty but once. This site says that all LB's were trained and indoctrinated by George and Betty themselves. That wasn't 100% accurate.


        This is a joke right????

   You think this statement is evidence that this BB prints crap?

      Juststarted if you are serious then include some more information, quotes, dates, places etc...evidence.

Speaking of accuracy. the small assembly I was in they had workers meetings,-maybe a former worker could confirm did they have to report into GG either before or after these meetings, There were leading brothers meetings and i am willing to bet they were accountable to GG. Oh and then there was that week in August every year called the workers conference/seminar, plus the other seminars ie midwest spring,fall,winter, tape meetings. I dont believe for a minute that not all LB's were indoctrinated By GG and BG. After all there were the 40 something characteristics of a worker.

Juststarted... please feel free to as vanDyke said provide actual facts supporting your comments.


To Vandyke.
I apologize if i have contributed to this thread becoming off topic. Just say the word and i'll move my post 

Tom:

You know, now that I think about it a little more, I'm getting my information sources mixed up.

I was thinking of the "Rick Ross" site, in which was an article wherein it was claimed that the Assembly had a church in New Jersey.  I do not recall that ever being the case (I think they were making a mistaken reference to the Assembly in Providence, Rhode Island). This is the link:
 
http://www.rickross.com/reference/assembly/assembly29.html

(by the way, the 100% comment belongs to the Rick Ross site as well).

But here is one thing I can remember off the top of my head:

Here on this website, it was stated that Rod Zach and family had relocated to Grand FORK, Nebraska (it was really Grand ISLAND, Nebraska, and I believe that this was corrected.)

Dave/Vandyyke (where did you get that name, anyway?):

I made no assertion whatever that I am being forced to read your posts.  It seems that you have inferred that from my statements.  Sometimes I find them amusing, more often I find them lame, including your misuse of words such as "assertion".

Matt Sciaini

          Matt, you are a nice guy! Yet you seem to have problems communicating with people. You jump on the BB with the intention of dissing my blogs? (inept as always)

                       Why?   Do you want to defend Kenneth Copeland Ministries? Then be my guest!

   Are you lonely and want company? Then learn how to communicate with people!

  Matt what have you done with your life since the Assembly? Do you attend Church anywhere? Have you done anything with your degree? Have you ever tried to find a mate?

Dave/Vandyyke:

To what problems do you refer?

I am not trying to defend Kenneth Copeland Ministries, or any of these people that you bring into the spotlight, to show us their sin.

I have started a new thread with a challenge to you, so why don't you go over there and see what I have to say?

Once again, what problems am I having in communicating?  I simply tell you what I think and you do not like it.

As for your last questions......

I am going to a church, I have a job, and I am still single. 

Matt Sciaini

 what problems am I having in communicating? 
                     
                                      Quote from Matt


   Matt a few years ago I was explaing to a group of people at a Bible Study in El Segundo about The Assembly. A guy jumped up and said, "Does a real querky guy named Matt go to that church?"  Dude you have a problem communicating! People in The Assembly constantly confronted you on it! Jim McCalister had a stewardship devoted to this very issue!


 But Matt, I really don't want you to change!  I want to keep my memories of the Assembly alive and fresh in my mind! So please don't ever change!

             

A guy jumped up and said, "Does a real querky guy named Matt go to that church?"  Dude you have a problem.


Seeing there is only one person named Matt in Orange County (population 3 million +), it had to be Sciaini he was talking about!  ;D ;D

By the way, there was this guy named John I'm looking for---he was in the Navy between 1983-1990. Anyone have any idea where I might be able to locate him?

Dave:

As Joe said by means of humor in his post, there are three million people in Orange County, hundreds if not thousands of whom are named "Matt".

As for the deal with Jim McAllister (sp), that was 1987-1989 (nearly and more than twenty years ago, when I was still a college student).

I can only hope I have changed in some degree since my early twenties. 

I am tempted to believe that the quote from you, which I posted down below, is a prank.  At least I trust that you are "majorly" yanking my chain.

Otherwise, I have to agree with Joe, that you do have a problem.

Matt Sciaini

Otherwise, I have to agree with Joe, that you do have a problem.

I don't think I'd say that Dave has a problem. But I found the reference to "Matt" to be
quite funny.  I saw this comedian once who said "Me and Elvis had a lot in common, we
were in the Navy together".  And seeing how many people are in the Navy at the same time,
the line was pretty hilarious at the time.   ;D

--Joe

Wanna go steady?  :rofl:

Moonflower:

I can only assume that you are completely and totally yanking the proverbial chain, as your little laughing buddy illustrates so well.  ;)

I don't know....can you handle "quirky"?  Remember, according to Vandyyke, I should stay the same so he can keep all his Assembly memories.    ??? How is that for best wishes?

Matt Sciaini

Vandyyke:

I am not arguing that I don't have a problem communcating;  I merely asked "to what problem are you referring?"

Matt Sciaini

FYI-  The guy who jumped up at the Bible Study use to work with Matt.



         I'm checking out!  This is because after my vaca I am returning to the real world of school. I will be reading good books and having good interactive conversation/debate on all many different aspects of the American Revolution. Being around a group of history majors can be lot like being around a group of theologins. People can get very passionate about their veiwpoints. With the right kind of moderation it can be a very positive learning experience! Forgive me if my desire to fill the void of summer has left you feeling used!   

                     see ya!