AssemblyBoard

The fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness faithfulness, gentleness and self control.

So just how does this define Tim Geftakys:

Love:  Tim "loves" it when he doesn't have to hold a job and can still collect a paycheck!!!

Joy:  Tim was probably not very "joyful" when his crooked dad's ministry was exposed, and lost his only source of income.

Peace:  His house must be very "peaceful" when everyone else is at work and he can sit and home and do whatever it is that  he does.

Patience:  This one's on me...I have waited very patiently for you (Tim) to be exposed, and am thoroughly enjoying kicking you while you are down!  

Kindness:  Tim can be very kind to someone if he needs something

Goodness:  Tim's not only "good", but a great guy...And if you don't believe it, just ask him!!!

Faithfulness:  Tim has always been very "faithful" about not dieting...Just look at that "pot belly"!!!

Gentleness:  I am sure Tim was very delicate and gently shredded  any financial documents that would have exposed the illegal activity that he was involved in.

Self Control:  Tim showed a tremendous amount of "self control" when he decided not to report his sadistic brother.  I'm sure it just tore at him.

Tim - you are right up there with David Koresh and Jim Jones!!!

I am getting a kick out of this!!!!  ;D :D :) :P :o ;D

Geez--I take back what I said on another post
board about showing your anger. I think you
should be able to post how you feel, but enjoying
kicking someone while they are down is definitely
not a fruit of the Spirit. I'm sure Tim Geftakys has
done many wrong things, but what we should be
hoping and praying for is that he will repent and
acknowledge any sins, and learn from all of this.
I'm not trying to say you can't express yourself all
you want to, but remember one criteria as a Christian
is always to ask yourself "What would Jesus do in this situation?" I don't think you'd find Jesus in the crowd of people kicking Tim while he is down. He'd be exhorting and admonishing Tim, but for the sole purpose of bringing
him back to himself, not to drag him through the dirt.

Im glad somebody is!!!

Bluejay mind if I ask you what your experience is  with TIM?

Dave  - For a start, lets just say it was extremely unpleasant.... And thats putting it mildly.

Joe - never in my life have I kicked someone when they were down.  But to read on the website yesterday that he is up and preaching again makes me physically ill.  How ARROGANT can he possibly be to just assume that now that things are slowly starting to blow over that he should preach or assume some role of leadership.
He has no business giving guidance to anyone...He couldn't lead a fish to water.

Bluejay

Hmmm....I'm having a hard time feeling sorry for Tim.  I don't think Bluejay has said the half of it.  Tim is lucky that the people he made merchandise of are forgiving, merciful folk, else, well...I doubt Tim would be >able< to preach again.

Arthur - your right...I haven't said the half of it.....But I will!!!

 I have not been around Tim in 17 years. Can anyone tell me if he has or has not become more Christ like ? Does his actions, speach and character reflect Christ and draw you closer to God ?

Blue Jay, Arthur----

I guess you would more personally know what Tim
geftakys is all about. I spoke with him a few times back
int he old Assembly days, but I lived in the Valley. I
don't know much about him---but I was just replying to
the sentence "I'm kicking you while your down and I'm
enjoying it"---I just can't picture Jesus when he was cleansing the Temple and whipping the moneychangers
having a smile on his face, and laughing with glee. I think he was more sad than anything, and angry at what the
people had turned his Father's house into. I believe he wants us to be vigilant, but not take joy in the fall of others-I'm not saying "feel sorry" for Tim but as Jesus said "Pray for them which spitefully abuse you"--"Pray for your enemies". You can be angry, but as others have pointed out to me on this BB, you can cross a line and enter into
viciousness which helps no one. If I'm wrong about this than perhaps you know better. I'm just stating an opinion.

Take Care,   Joe

Oh, I see.  But who said that?

Arthur----

Look at Bluejay's post below where he lists love,
truth patience, etc.  Look at the Patience line
Patience: "This one's for me, I'm kicking you(Tim)
while you are down and I am thoroughly enjoying
it"---that's what I was repsonding to.

--Joe

Joe,
Having examined the anonymous "Bluejay's" 25 posts (to date) it is apparent that he is in no way interested in "WWJD".  I'm sure he's been hurt but the answer is to turn to the great Healer, not to multiply sin.

Ro 12:19 - Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but [rather] give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance [is] mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

Verne,

I very much agree with you that "There is a scripturally warranted way to express righteous indignation and the Church needs to learn it!" (see Mt 23).

However, if you mean to defend what Bluejay is doing as fitting into the category of Christlike "fiery rhetoric", I must disagree.

IMHO, what we are seeing from Bluejay is sarcasm, vindictiveness and no Scriptural support.  (If you can find it in any of his posts, please tell me.)  I'm going to pray for Bluejay.  He needs Christ!  Anger, fine, but sin not (Eph 4:26).

BTW - I think that Brent is right on the mark w/his most recently posted article, "Bewitched and Deceived".  I believe he has been a good example of Christlike anger.  He is not vindictive but addresses the evil scripturally.

I don’t like that vindictiveness stuff, but sarcasm can sometimes be used to help even a thick headed person like me understand things for which I was lacking perspective.

Bluejay, I appeciate your boldness!  Keep it up, you crack me up!!!  ;D :D 8) :) ;)

retread,
My point is that sarcasm is something that is totally absent from Christ in the Bible.  In fact I don't know of any godly use of sarcasm there.  We can read examples of ungodly men using it however.  I'm not saying that it can never be used appropriately, but that its use should be with great carefulness.
I believe that Bluejay's manner, which BTW, is devoid of Scripture backing or reference, really appeals to the incitement of mob "action" and not to the building up and healing needed in the lives of believers.

Good Friends! :)
  I looked up the word "sarcasm" in the dictionary and it is associated with speech and it is difficult to convey in writing because it has to do with the tone and inflection of the voice.  It does contain a mocking tone that often uses irony.  As I read the words of Jesus in Mt. 23 I discover that he is certainly mocking the Pharisees: and "Ye blind fools", serves as a good example.
  It seems to be a characteristic of the BB at times that the victims of abuse are exhorted re. the tone of their anger instead of placing the focus on the abuser.  Verses reminding us to "love our enemies" are used to bring the angry reactor back to "a proper attitude,"  as if this is the need of the hour.
  Jesus did not say to the offended little one's, after harshly warning the offenders, to be careful not to get angry with those abusing you.  We must be careful that we don't make the Assembly argument for them by turning the tables on those who have suffered greatly at the hands of those leading the Assembly.  Remember, these are Christians who treated us this way, and they still have not been very forthcoming in their recognition of their offenses against their brethren.
  I guess, if you don't agree that the Assembly was a very bad place, then you don't think that severity of speech is necessary.  Jesus said of the church at Laodicea that the Christians there made Him vomit!  Why?  For being in a condition of unrepentant, hypocritical, self righteousness.
I would contend that such speech is appropriate to the present Assembly condition and as such should be the focus of our present ire, vs. those who for years were pounded by these abusers.
  Anger is part of the process of recovery and it is better to express it here, where there are those who understand and can offer consolation, then to be forced to internalize it.  Especially, when the exhorted is made to feel that "they have sinned" for sharing their outrage.
   I'm with Jesus; some present Assembly folks make me vomit!
                          God Bless,  Mark
     

Oh come on now Tim...Not all of my posts have been sarcastic.  Some have even been well thought out.  

Normally, I would confront whoever I had issues with face to face.  The problem is that these people are going to tell me what I want to hear then slowly but surely go back to their hyprocritcal ways.  Therefore, why would I waste the time.

Got to get back to the Texas Tech - Texas game.

Thank you Verne!
   You have raised a very important fact, and that is to not ignore the truth that God is the mover and shaker in all these events.  It is truly God's great mercy to continually knock at the door of the Assembly and invite them to a full repentance.(especially after all that GG did to God's sheep)
   Certainly, recent events should have gotten our attention, but what is God saying in them?  GG is a bad man, but his teaching is holy and good?  GG is a bad man, but only some of his teaching is holy and good?
   I vote for GG is a bad man and each and everything GG taught and practiced should be critically examined.  In order for this examination to be valid Assembly members must seek help from those not raised up in the same system they came from.
   When God judged the Pharisees he said "the axe was layed to the root."  Is it hyper-critical to ask that at least present Assembly members think that quite possibly God is trying to reach them through the present events and that humble reception of those seeking to help them is a worthy pursuit?
              God wants to bless,  Mark  

OK Blue,
1. I'll admit it, not all of your posts are sarcastic.  Of the now 27 posts I did find 2, maybe 3 or 4, w/no sarcasm.  After delving into them more deeply, I did find much to agree with and much to chuckle at.  I especially liked your post on Feb. 25 @ 3:37pm (CST) under "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest".  :D
2. You're probably right about confronting face-to-face" in this instance. But I think you're using wrong tactics in the manner of your attack.  Those who might be inclined to be rescued from continuing in the delusion, are more likely to be influenced from a scripturally based attack or one that is at least more specific.
3. Texas-Texas Tech?!? In basketball?! Why don't you go for a real game, like Illinois (beat MU today to tie for Big 10 1st. GO Illini!)  ;D

Tim Souther:

O.K. so maybe I tend to be a little sarcastic from time to time.  

As for my approach, I have tip toed around this subject matter for ten years now.  The leaders of the "assembly's" game plan of not allowing people to question anything or call leading brothers out has now completely backfired.  People like myself are now holding absolutely nothing back.  Had many of these issues been resolved correctly, ie. if there had been some sort of system of checks and balances, many issues could have been resolved in a more timely manner.  There is a lot of built up anger that could have easily been avoided.    

After all thats been said and done, if there are people that continue to follow these men, you have to worry about the stability in their own lives.  

This is really a weak post on my behalf, but I'm in a hurry... More to come tomorrow!!!

I think we all need to keep in mind that the 'assembly' has turned many people completely away from the Lord.  Hopefully the deterioration of the 'assembly' will help some of those people rebuild their relationship with Christ.  Bluejay, as mentioned in an earlier post, is my brother-  my husband and I pray every day that the Lord will regain a hold in his life and the lives of our other family members.  Both of my brothers were ruined spiritually b/c of their involvement with the 'assembly'.  We were all told that we weren't good enough and were made to feel as though we didn't measure up.  Since the 'saints' were the only standard for Christianity that we knew, we began to despise anything and everything to do with religion and the church.  

At times I feel outrage that the likes of people like Tim G. or numerous others could have had such a terrible impact on so many, namely my brother.  But, I will continue to pray for him b/c I have absolute faith that he will once again know the Lord's love and faithfulness in his life.

In the meantime, let's just keep in mind that Bluejay and others may not be posting with any regard to spiritual things.   I didn't realize that doing so was a prerequisite for this board!  

Vbeers:

Yours is a point well taken.  In addition, though some have not lost their faith (and thus perhaps held to a higher standard in light of their professing faith in Christ), there has been GREAT damage done to their walk with Christ.  Just as you don't beat a baby christian over the head with bible verses, expecting them to "get in line", most of those who have come out of the assembly are just like those baby christians.  We know a lot of bible verses.  But head knowledge does not equate into practical application.  It is through the loving involvement of people who reach out to these hurting brothers and sisters that will win them and Christ will be the one to change their outward behavior.  It is an age old assembly technique to attempt to change peoples behavior through condemnation and "scripture beating".  We all know what fruit this produces. :P  

Try reaching out through posts or even better yet, pm someone you identify with and begin a private dialogue that God can use to change our brothers and sisters.  Not by condemning them, but by reaching out and ministering the love of Christ.  This is what changes men and women, not judgemental pointing the finger, etc.

my two cents for what it's worth! ;)

all good, however, it's not my goal to change anyone.  i only pray for them and hopefully, through prayer the Lord will change them.  in the meantime, to each his own in this process of healing...

Well said Ed!!!  Things have come full circle...Issues were never dealt with, thus their is a lot of built up anger and even hatred.  The leaders have no one to blame but themselves.   No one should feel sorry for any of the Geftakys men about the heat they are getting.