Mike Zach and the clan

[Uh Oh]

Greetings Caan:

About the time I had enough of the assembly, MZ paid a visit. I was sitting in my metal chair and out of the corner of my eye I noticed him giving me the death stare . The old "I know who you are and what you are thinking" type mental game the arrogant and manipulative play with lesser mortals to intimidate and establish their own superiority. Know what I mean? I got irritated and finally turned my head in his direction and looked him in the eye with the same look. He turned away. I never ever sought any counsel/contact with him. I vaguely remember his sermonette was about the authority of the leadership....
You are right. He is just a polished con man. Try to get it out of your system as soon as possible so that your experience(s) doesn't warp you (I'm not suggesting that you are warped). You probably have every reason to be cynical and don't need any more lame advice. Pardon mine.

I really don't think Mike is a con man...I really think Mike had good intentions going into this whole ordeal way back when.   Its not like he was going around driving Jeep Cherokees and Convertibles like a certain other family was.  I think Mike is human, and when he realized the crimes and faults taking place in the assembly hierarchy, he was painted into a corner.  Rather than take a stand and risk his income, he chose the easy way out.  He probably stayed silent and  hoped this thing would blow over.  Does this make it right...Absolutely not.  However, calling him a con man is a bit of a stretch.  He is simply a guy who got way in over his head and made some devastating decisions.

The thing that still gets me is that all of these former  leaders have "apologized".  The bottom line is that had they not been caught, not one of them would have come clean.  The only thing they are sorry about is the fact they got caught and it ruined their little power trips.

[Arthur]

i started out thinking the assembly was all good and the more i looked and the more i learned the worse it got - far worse than i had ever imagined it could get.

Same here, what a nightmare.  Still makes me angry.  We were betrayed.  

but i agree with your basic point that we'll be better off focusing on the good than focusing on the negative - while not forgetting the harsh reality of the negative.

I agree.  That's a good way of putting it, Brian.  How else should we live our lives?  Focusing on the negative sucks and doesn't help anything.  But we do not forget (as if we could) how we've been burned lest it happen again.  

[Arthur]

I looked him straight in the eye, waited a second, and hiccuped in his hand.  I dissapointment of the group surrounding us was tangible.  He gave me a displeased look.  Whoops!

Hehe, you didn't perform for him and made him look somewhat less than all-powerful.  Tsk tsk, the nerve.  Kids can do the darndest things.

[Eulaha L. Long]

I have always wondered: can an ordinary man marry people?  Like Mike Zach, for example.  He's not a real pastor...how is it he is allowed to marry anyone?  Just wondering...

[Caan]

Eulaha,
    I believe just about anyone can get a license to marry people.  Remember Joey married Monica and Chandler on "Friends"?  I think you really can get a license to marry over the internet.  In fact, that's where I'm headed right now.....

[retread]

I have always wondered: can an ordinary man marry people?  Like Mike Zach, for example.  He's not a real pastor...how is it he is allowed to marry anyone?  Just wondering...

I don't know if I would call Mike an ordinary man (in the past he has exhibited behavior that I hope would not be often seen in ordinary folk ), but I would think that it would be fairly easy for someone like Mike to get the appropriate license to perform legally recognized marriages.  Requirements for licensing probably vary by state, but include people such as justices of the peace, notary publics, county clerks, sea captains, ordained ministers...  If for some reason Mike could not get the appropriate license, the couple to be married could always get a quick legal ceremony by a JP, and then get Mike to do a ceremony as well.

[vbeers]

uh oh-

i agree that the zachs had and still have good intentions.  they were very dear to my family in many ways.  caan, have you ever been married?  i am married and i think my wedding was the best one ever!!    i think that is how everyone should feel after their big day.  i know that the zachs felt dan's wedding was perfect and regardless of how horrible the assembly system was / is, i agree that bashing such an event is a bit overkill.

uh oh,  you said that you are disheartened that had the lb's not ever been caught they never would have apologized.  i agree this to be true.  but, do you think that they knew that what they were doing was wrong?  i mean, i left almost ten years ago but didn't realize until "the fall" how deeply i had been scarred by the assembly...for instance, there is nothing i love to see more than young people (especially high school and college students) living a life for the Lord.  HOWEVER, i still, to this day, do not feel adequate to have that kind of relationship / communion with the Lord.  why???  b/c i was never good enough when i was "IN"...

[Oscar]

Eulaha,
    I believe just about anyone can get a license to marry people.  Remember Joey married Monica and Chandler on "Friends"?  I think you really can get a license to marry over the internet.  In fact, that's where I'm headed right now.....

In California anyone you recognize as competent can perform the ceremony.

What makes the marriage legal is the marriage license.

I "married" Mark and Sindy Campbell.  I signed the license and mailed it in in the envelope that comes with it.  They sent it back because I hadn't filled out the box that said "Official Title".  (What if I had just tossed it?)

I finally wrote "minister" and mailed it back.

So, they are legal.  I guess?  

Thomas Maddux

[d3z]

I have always wondered: can an ordinary man marry people?  Like Mike Zach, for example.  He's not a real pastor...how is it he is allowed to marry anyone?  Just wondering...

At least in California the only thing needed is witnesses.  There is actually special provisions for "religious groups with no recognized clergy."

I don't know how it works in other states, but there are probably similar loopholes.

[sharonhb]

Let's hope so! Otherwise, all the couples married in the assemblies would be...well, you figure it out...

[sharonhb]

And wouldn't THAT! be a fine mess...what else could happen???

[d3z]

Another interesting aspect about marriage law in California: if both people believe that the marriage was valid, it is.  At worst, it might break down into a common-law marriage.

If these marriages were done before God, and I believe they were, then the worst that would be the case with state law would be a matter of paperwork, and at worst involve a judge.

I mean, our culture doesn't care much about marriage (unless gays want to marry).  The state marriage process was, at least originally, just mirroring what was done before God.

[Uh Oh]

[ why???  b/c i was never good enough when i was "IN"...

VBeers -

I completely agree that it was unfair for captains to pick teams based on ability in assembly touch football games.  You said referring to your self "I was never good enough when I was in". That is true...You were not very talented athletically and that was probably the reason that you were picked last every time.  I think the hope was that you would eventually give up and quit trying to play.  Please realize that your perseverance was respected by everyone.  Please do not blame the leading brothers for this - only blame the assembly flag football captains and others for not sticking up for you.  Looking back on things, we probably could have agreed to pick you first or second from time to time - who was keeping win/loss records anyway.

In your earlier post, you alluded to the fact that you were unhappy  with the  leading brothers because after all of these years of watching and attempting to play football, you thought that you got five downs to make ten yards instead of four downs to make ten yards.  You also suggested that this was in fact leaderships fault.  I have to take the side of the leadership in this case...Although this was never explained to you, they probably just assumed that you would figure this aspect of the game of football out.

Just my opinion - take it or leave it.