Hi Marcia

George said that.
He also had alot to say, especially recently, about believing the best (lie) about brethren.  (himself)

He also talked alot about how unity was the important thing right now.  (As opposed to truth.)

George had us all upside down and backwards in our thinking.  Most of us still are.

If the shoe fits.....

Brent

Forgive me.  I do not want to maintain the 'old' attititude.  However, we need to be careful that our 'own' hearts remain humble before the Lord, and do not become/remain bitter in adopting any 'new/old' attitudes.  God wants healing, and I'm for whatever He want to do.   I've had to deal with bitterness in my own heart (for other issues). Now, I refuse any tinge of bitterness to enter, and God always comes through.
The sin in the camp needs to be exposed.  Someone shared with me (from Exodus) about AI. And much repenting is needed by all (including myself).

Marcia:

It may be difficult to see from your perspective, but some of us are indeed speaking the truth in love.

The root of bitterness was not the root of our troubles, it was the sins of the leadership that was the root of our troubles. If there are those amongst us who are bitter (and there very may well be), then the Lord will also hold the leadership accountable for the results of their sins which includes this bitterness. These people were in leadership, they had a great responsibility.  But I do agree that we carefully need to examine ourselves, and if there be any bitterness in our hearts we need to have that dealt with.

Amen. I totally agree with you on this, but I do not believe this describes the heart of this bulletin board's creator or many of the others on this web site who have described what they have observed. Despite the fact that I was greatly wronged by the leadership, I never had bitterness, anger, or wrath, even at the time that I was wronged. However, I must say that my heart was greatly hurt by this experience. Since "leaving fellowship", I have spent years praying for those who remained, as I am sure many others have as well.  This does not come from bitterness Marcia, this comes from love.  There is a lot of first hand experience brought to this web site, and I have seen very little conjecture (apart from some that may be included in the humor / sarcasm that is sometimes found here).

Marcia, I don't consider the work that Brent and others have done as airing out dirty laundry.  Brent and others have made a great effort to right the wrongs of the leadership before this web site came about, but the leadership did nothing of great consequence.  This web site has forced those in leadership to acknowledge their sin's.  We must remember that these people were in leadership, they ran the show.  I say praise God for men like Brent, who are not afraid to stand up for what is right

Open rebuke is better than secret love. Faithful are the wounds of a friend; but the kisses of an enemy are deceit. (Proverbs 27:5-6)

Sometimes open rebuke is needed.  The leadership's sins needed to be dealt with.  Their sin could not continue.  It would have been great if this could have been done without this web site, but sometimes, people need to be "hit over the head" with the truth to see the error of their way.  I would hope that those in leadership would be thankful, that things have been made clear to them, so that they can repent.  I believe that heaven was rejoicing over Danny E's repentance. I am so glad that he turned his back on the ways of the past, and is making steps on following what God would have for him.  This is a good thing.  No, this is a GREAT thing. My tears of sorrow have been changed to tears of joy for what the Lord is doing in this man's life. I pray that others would turn their lives around as well. I would hope that this would be your desire as well. But even if it is only one man who repents, a great work has still been done.

Marcia, in some cases the "shoe may fit", I do not know anyone here well enough to discern this.  But your statement may look to some as a way to blame the victim and excuse the perpetrators in leadership.  There are some seriously hurt people here, may God's grace be shown to them.  Many also left because they could not abide with the rampant unrepentant "way of life" sin that they were exposed to.  They asked themselves, "What fellowship can light have with darkness?"  It is very important to remember that these sins were in the leadership.

Marcia, pray for your local leadership.  Challenge them to examine themselves to see if there was any complicity to any of these sins in their leadership, that the Lord's testimony would remain pure.

I am sure that you have seen God work in your gathering as I had also seen God work in my local gathering when I was "in fellowship".  And for a lot of the sins that I have seen talked about here, I have also seen the opposite as well.  Some posted of families being torn apart my manipulative leadership, but I have also seen families brought together in service to our Lord.  But this isn't the point, we are not keeping a score sheet here.  We just want God to be honored and his people be delivered from sin. I am sure that many of our hearts are saddened when we hear of the great sins that have occurred. From your post I "assume" that you may still be "in fellowship".  If this is so, please let us know how God is working in your gathering, so that we too may be encouraged.  I am hoping and praying that the Lord would do a great work in all these matters.

Some of us have needed slaps in the face, hits over the head, etc. so that we can see some of the hurt that we have caused.  I don't believe that the hurt was premeditated nor was it intentional, but we did it nonetheless.  So Marcia, let them air what they want.  We need to hear it so that God can dig down to the very depths of what this ministry has inculcated in our souls.  If you didn't do any of these things, then praise the Lord!  I would encourage you however to get before the Lord and examine yourself thoroughly to make sure that this is indeed the case.

I can't believe how many mind shifts that I have gone through in the last four weeks.  And that was after escaping some of the "Assembly mold" for the last three or four years!  I had truly changed.  But I still didn't see the depth of it.  Perhaps I still don't.

I have been willing to hear what all have had to say in the last four weeks, and I believe it is that willingness that has showed me much of my error.

The only thing that I could say to the original posters to the board is Please have mercy on us!!  And I don't mean make nice posts or anything like that.  What I mean by mercy is that when we are truly seeing these things and repenting, please, please let us do that.  Just as you saw things finally after some odd years, we are seeing it all now too.  Keep it up, because it seems that more and more are seeing the truth!!

Remember we are not fighting against FLESH AND BLOOD, but POWERS AND PRINCIPALITIES.  Do I say that to take the blame off of myself?  Absolutely not!!  My point is that we need your help.  Yes, that includes speaking the truth boldly and sometimes harshly, but make sure you are praying for us and well, I don't know what else that would mean.  God would certainly tell you.

I have lost a dear friend due to former choices and ignorance and it grieves me!!!!  I went over my journal from 97-00 and saw the changes that God was getting in me, but I was BLIND to some other things.  So LET THEM TALK.  If you don't want to hear it, then don't get on the boards.  (I'm saying that with a nice tone, by the way).

Andrea Denner

 

I can understand that some people feel burnt and betrayed by their respect/idolatry of George G. and that people did suffer some negative things inside the Assembly as they have related here in stories of how they felt controlled or constrained by the strict standards that the Assembly demands in the name of the Lord's Will being done.   However, others have had a positive experience in the Assembly and believe it is or was what God wanted for them at a certain stage in their lives.  

Apart from a few leaders people have been talking about, I do not believe for a minute that many people in the Assembly were intentionally trying to control them by dictating God's Will for their lives.  I believe that most people were/are sincere and do want to know what God wants.  I am convinced that people were following beliefs they thought were the truth and that it why some people felt steamrolled by the Assembly's interpretation of the truth.  But we must be humble and realize as it says in 1 Corinthians that "we peer through a glass darkly" and that we cannot see all there is to see.  

In my opinion, God's Will and how it is found will have to be very seriously reevaluated.  Seeking approval/asking permission of the leadership/unity of the saints will have to be dropped to allow people to find God's desire for their own lives.  Advice is fine, but it should only be advice.  Many of the social standards implemented by the Assembly that are not clearly talked about in the Bible will have to be examined like relationships for one.  And the idea of spiritual superiority will have to be dropped to or it will always be wrong to leave the Assembly or have different standards than the Assembly.  From what I have been told, this deep examination is what is in fact going on at present in more than one Assembly.  All things work together for good!

Marica is correct:  we must be very careful HOW and WHAT we say.  But what we are witnessing here on this BB is early steps in the process of recovery and this involves talking it out and sharing some of the hurt.  However, we do not need to know all the details about "George's Sin" or the names of those who were taken advantage of.  

Witchhunts should also not be tolerated here.  As Marica said, "Remember the French Revolution."  What started out as a good thing--the overthrow of an oppresive regime--ended very badly.

However, if leaders in the various Assembly's are telling people they should not be reading this website or other things then... Hmm...  

If anyone is still considering leaving fellowship, they should try to ask everyone, "Does anyone have anything against me or are there any issues that need to be dealt with before I leave?"  If you do think you want to close the door on you Assembly involvement, try to end things on a good note.  I did and it allowed me to keep in contact off and on with people I still care very much about.  If you loved the saints when you were in the Assembly, you still need to love them afterwards... and they you.  

From what I have been told, the Assemblies are reevaluating their beliefs.  Perhaps we should all, until proof is offered to the contrary, take much of what has been said about the Assembly's practices and beliefs as the PAST.  The Bible says that in Christ we are new creations.  Now everything is AG, After George.  We should believe that best, that something new will happen.

We should be careful about how we weep about the past because a shout of joy has come in this new morning!