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Author Topic: ***THE PASSION OF THE CHRIST***  (Read 23910 times)
al Hartman
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« on: February 19, 2004, 03:19:44 pm »


     One week in advance of the national release of Mel Gibson's  The Passion of the Christ, I offer this thread as a forum for opinion, discussion and testimony regarding what may be one of the most influential representations of Jesus Christ of our times.
     Extreme controversy surrounding the film started months in advance of its debut.  Having read several articles and viewed Diane Sawyer's hour-long interview of Gibson and E.T.'s interview of Jim Caviezel, who enacts the role of Jesus, I offer the following prayer requests:

--For a positive testimony of Christ's love and sacrifice to every viewer.
--That everyone will see it who should see it.
--For prepared & open hearts & minds.  Sinners & saints.
--For every Christian to be ready to speak a word to those who may have questions after seeing the film.  Yes, even to strangers.  This may be an occasion and an opportunity like no other.
--For the exercise of wisdom regarding children's viewing of the film.  It is extremely violent, as befits the violence our Lord suffered for us.  Adults may be wise to view it before deciding about the children, then return with the children if it is deemed advisable.
--For a great harvest of souls brought to repentance and redemption.
--This is an occasion of spiritual warfare:  Pray for the victory!

     What do you think, anticipate, hope for, recommend?


« Last Edit: February 19, 2004, 03:20:31 pm by al Hartman » Logged
al Hartman
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« Reply #1 on: February 19, 2004, 03:30:43 pm »


     Here is a link to a brief article spoofing the allegation that Gibson & his film are anti-semitic.  The article is joking, but you may be encouraged to read the numerous Christian emails of respone that follow it:

          http://www.scrappleface.com/MT/archives/001593.html
« Last Edit: February 20, 2004, 05:45:48 am by brian tucker » Logged
outdeep
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« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2004, 07:27:17 pm »

I have been following the Passion for several months now.  When I was at an employee retreat in West Virginia, Mel Gibson was there to show Dr. Graham and Franklin Graham his movie.  I didn't get to see Mr. Gibson, however.

Most stories I read from TownHall were overwhelming positive.  One warning story came from John Fischer on the Breakpoint website.  He was afraid that the Evangelical community would rally around to movie to such an extent that it would become a "Christian outreach thing" and, as a result, alienate the very people they are trying to reach.  Secularists would probably want to go see a movie.  But, they won't want to see it if they imagine it as pushy evangelism or in the same genre as "Left Behind", "Thief in the Night" and the "Jesus" film.

While Mr. Fischer has a point, I'm not sure what practically can be done about that.  Christians are going to get excited.  Those in Hollywood live in such a different world, it is like a cool drink in the desert when a movie comes out that protrays Jesus as somthing other than a homosexual struggling with his identity.

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al Hartman
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« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2004, 04:03:11 am »



     Here is a link to a brief article spoofing the allegation that Gibson & his film are anti-semitic.  The article is joking, but you may be encouraged to read the numerous Christian emails of respone that follow it:

          http://www.scrappleface.com/MT/archives/001593.html

Aha! I knew it! I knew if I waited long enought I would finally find a typo by Al-preview-before you-post Hartman. Yippee! He is human just like me and Tom Maddux!   Grin
Verne


     I am obligatted to repond to this allagetion:  It was my secetrary's falt!

Here's another site to look at:  

     http://www.thepassionofthechrist.com/trailers/index.html

     (I don't know why these links aren't coming up as hyperlinks...  Brian?) Huh

al

« Last Edit: February 20, 2004, 05:45:22 am by brian tucker » Logged
sfortescue
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« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2004, 05:47:04 am »

The links aren't coming out right because you're using the wrong tags.

[]means underline[]

[[url]]means a web link[[/url]]
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brian
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« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2004, 05:48:53 am »

(I don't know why these links aren't coming up as hyperlinks...  Brian?) Huh

you have formed the bad habit of hitting the U (underline) button instead of the URL button (insert hyperlink) - its the one with the little pic of a globe on it. theres many a slip twixt keyboard and click...  Smiley

brian
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Joe Sperling
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« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2004, 07:25:58 am »

Al---


You got corrected on your spelling. Someone told me the other day my grammar was bad. But that's so malicious--my grammar lived to be 81 and was one of the nicest people you'd ever want to meet.



Horrible joke. I know.  Back to the Passion links pronto!!
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al Hartman
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« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2004, 01:42:20 pm »



Steve,
     Thanks for the info.

Brian,
     Thanks for fixing it.

Joe,
     Thanks for...    Huh

 ;Dal Wink

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Joe Sperling
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« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2004, 08:48:00 pm »

Al---

I've noticed through the months that the first "reviews" so to speak were very negative from the Christian community. There was even some mention of "strange events" occuring(the person playing Judas being hit by lightning, etc.). But as time has gone on, it's become more and more positive---I really want to see the movie when it comes out.

--Joe
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al Hartman
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« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2004, 08:57:30 pm »

Al---

I've noticed through the months that the first "reviews" so to speak were very negative from the Christian community. There was even some mention of "strange events" occuring(the person playing Judas being hit by lightning, etc.). But as time has gone on, it's become more and more positive---I really want to see the movie when it comes out.

--Joe

     Actually, it was Jim Caviezel, as Christ, who was struck by lightning.  To get the full effect of the darkened heavens, they filmed the crucifixion during a storm.  When they erected the cross lightning struck him.  He said in an interview that cast & crew members said there was "fire coming out of my head."
     Caviezel, a devout Roman Catholic as is Mel Gibson, said he believes that such events (there were others) were signs of God's approval of their work, rather than otherwise.


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jloadams
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« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2004, 04:46:37 am »

I do hope that Christians will take the opportunity to set the record straight on the "anti-semitic" issue.
 
It has been my experience that Christians hold no ill will towards the Jewish people, but rather rightly see them as the Apple of God's Eye, the Chosen People, and that their role in Christ's death was all a part of God's plan to reconcile mankind to Himself.
 
The Book of Acts, among others, is pretty clear that it is the death and ressurection of Christ that allows the rest of us...a people who were afar off...equal access to the promises of God.
 
Why would Christians blame the Jews for the very thing that gives us Salvation?

I believe we should all be ready to respond in a manner befitting a redeemed people when confronted with such accusations of anti-semitism.

Janet

   
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al Hartman
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« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2004, 10:48:38 am »




I do hope that Christians will take the opportunity to set the record straight on the "anti-semitic" issue...
 
Why would Christians blame the Jews for the very thing that gives us Salvation?

     Some American Jewish leaders have been very concerned about the impact of this film because of the passage in Matt.27:24-25:

     When Pilate saw that he could prevail nothing, but that rather a tumult was made, he took water, and washed his hands before the multitude, saying, I am innocent of the blood of this just person: see ye to it.
     Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children.

     For centuries nominal Christians, governments and the "official" church used those two verses as verification that all Jewish people were accursed, thus justifying the persecution of them.  My own father, born in 1905, related to me how as a little boy he would awake in the middle of the night to the sounds of rocks pelting the walls of his home, and voices yelling "Christ-killers!"

     In response to the concerns expressed by Jewish leaders, Mel Gibson removed the subtitle bearing verse 25 from the film.  The line can still be heard amid the crowd noises, but it is spoken in aramaic, which not many viewers will understand, particularly those who might be inclined toward anti-semitism.

     Nothing in scripture indicates that the statement of verse 25 resulted in a cursing of the Jewish people.  To the contrary, the gospel of Jesus Christ was taken to the Jews first, even after the crucifixion.

     Mel Gibson has stated clearly in public that anti-semitism is against the tenets of his faith, and that racial or religious prejudice and bigotry are sins.

     As a side issue, Mel Gibson's father, Hutton Gibson, 85, has made some decidedly anti-semitic statements, including, "They're after one world religion and one world government," and, "Is the Jew still actively anti-Christian?  He is, for by being a Jew, he is anti-everyone else."
     Hutton Gibson also alleges that the Nazis' extermination of 6 million Jews during the 1930s-1940s was "maybe not all fiction--but most of it is."  Of Federal Reserve chairman Alan Greenspan, the elder Gibson said that "Greenspan tells us what to do.  Someone should take him out and hang him."

     Mel Gibson has taken a lot of flak for not refuting his father's allegations but, to his credit, he has fulfilled the role of a faithful son.  "He's my father. I love him. Leave it alone," he told Diane Sawyer on national television.
     Mel Gibson has clearly stated his own position toward the Jewish people, which obviously opposes his father's views.  The public is obligated to accept his statements at face value, and has no right to demand that the man turn against his father.


I believe we should all be ready to respond in a manner befitting a redeemed people when confronted with such accusations of anti-semitism.

Janet

     Please, let us all seriously pray and prepare toward this goal.  Thank you, Janet.




   
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Gordon
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« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2004, 10:53:41 pm »

Maybe this will give you a glimpse of what to expect.
Love ya'll - Gordon.


MY ACCOUNT OF THE PASSION ( written after the movie )

 

After the Passion I was on my knees at midnight worshipping God. I stammered in my words, I really didn’t know what to say. At times, after the movie all I could do was worship or just whispering, “Thank you…thank you…thank you….you are holy, you are holy…holy…holy.”

 
This movie disturbed me, and humbled me. I had no idea…how much My Lord went through. I read the scriptures time and time again. I’ve preached, studied, meditated, discussed and written about the death of Christ more than I can remember.
 
But I had no idea it would be like this. I wasn’t even close.
 
**
 
It simply caught me unaware.
 
It was the most difficult movie to watch in my entire life. Every fiber of your being is disturbed watching the flogging scene. It was brutal, cruel and bloody. The scene was too much to endure. I had to watch it though because I knew in my heart that what Christ brought to me was not a beautifully packaged gift.
 
It’s not religion where everything is perfect, sparkling gold with a white ribbon to top it off.
 
It was love, and it was the intense love of laying down His life for mine - coupled with an intense suffering beyond the scope of my comprehension.
 
During the flogging scene I heard weeping, and sobbing in the theater. I still cannot escape the visceral experience of it.  
 
**
 
Watching this Savior fall again and again as he carried his cross made my head hang and caused me to bite my lip.
 
Deep down, I heard my flawed emotional cry, “This has to stop.”
 
One must be reminded of how Christ foretold his own death and upon seeing the reaction of people asked, “Does this offend you?” (John 7:61) Isn’t there another way we can come to God except you?
 
Funny thing, when you think about it: that’s exactly what the devil would have wanted. The whole time in the movie you see the constant battle to stop Christ from going to the cross. There’s has to be another way.  
 
There isn’t another way. It had to be suffering. All the extremities and complexities of sin required the sacrifice of the  Lamb of God at Calvary. He himself was zealous for this sacrifice. NOT MY WILL, but THINE.
 
He laid down his life of his own accord. The sentimental human heart cried for another way, but this is the way God chosen. You must realize Jesus Christ was in total control. During the arrest, when Peter tried to defend his master Christ reminded him in the scriptures, “Thinkest thou that I cannot pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legion of angels? But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled that thus it must be?” (Matthew 26:53-54)
 
It was the only way.
 
I believe that’s why it’s such a travesty to say there’s another way to heaven. By good works? By your own merits? By the beautiful religious pageantry, and rituals of religion? Purchase life with silver or gold? Of it all, filthy rags before Him.
 
To see my Savior go through this…this is the only way. He said it himself, “I am the Way…the Truth…and the Life”.
 
**
 
The crucifixion scene was intense. Your body shook and you winced at each impact. I felt a huge wave of sickness hearing the slamming of the hammer against the nail repeated again and again. It was a cold metal echo that haunted your soul. Then you watched the cross fall with Christ hanging and it just makes you want to say, “No more…” with tears running down your face.
 
It left you broken and spent.
 
AFTERMATH AND REFLECTION
 
Honestly, all I could do after watching the movie is to kiss the feet of my Savior, shedding tears of humility, awe, worship and thankfulness. Broken to pieces, hoping every piece would shed one tear of worship at his feet.
 
**
 
 
Anyone not disturbed watching this movie has something wrong. I totally understand why some women could not watch this movie. A friend of mine watched it with me, and she had to leave shaking and sobbing in tears.  She simply couldn’t take it anymore, and there were many moments I had to turn away from the screen.
 
But, if we let the blood, brutality and the emotion of the movie get the best of us, we missed the point. The point is how truly wretched our sin is. It was disgusting beyond comprehension before the holy vision of God. The point is we’ve made the death of Christ to be some beautiful painting by Leonardo Da Vinci.
 
My friend said the same thing too. She didn’t want the movie to be a week-long emotional ride, but she wanted an eternal mark on her life because she had a greater consideration of the death of Christ.
 
**
 
The Love of God was clearly demonstrated in the Passion. This movie gave a visual experience and breathed life to the scripture in a manner very few people could have captured in their own mind.
 
Mel Gibson wasn’t kidding – he wanted to push you over the edge and he did. The Passion left me numb and I’ve experienced the most intense thoughts, feeling and images of my entire life.
 
Hopefully, it will push you to worship him. To surrender your heart to Him again.
 
To pray to Him.
 
***
 
We love you God. You are Holy, you are awesome. We are in awe of you and your love. You are beautiful Jesus…there is no one like you. No one who deserved a greater place in our hearts. You are victorious. You are incredible. Thank you!!!
 
 
 
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al Hartman
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« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2004, 04:19:02 am »



Thanks, Gordon, for an excellent and heartfelt review.  Pray that multitudes will be so affected by this film, and that God's people will be ready to guide those who are moved to seek Him.

A positive review by columnist Cal Thomas of The Washington Post can be read at:

       http://washingtontimes.com/commentary/cthomas.htm


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Scott McCumber
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« Reply #14 on: February 29, 2004, 03:52:38 am »


Funny thing, when you think about it: that’s exactly what the devil would have wanted. The whole time in the movie you see the constant battle to stop Christ from going to the cross. There’s has to be another way.  
 

Here's a question:

In the bible, was Satan really seeking to stop Christ from going to the cross? I was always taught that Satan did not fully understand the purpose of the cross until the deed was done and it was too late.

As far as the film goes, I saw a contradiction in this regard. In the opening scene, Satan is trying to tempt Christ to not go the way of the cross. However, throughout the movie Satan is depicted as influencing Judas, moving through the Pharisees and the Romans, inciting them against Jesus.

So which is it?

Thanks in advance for your help.

S

PS - Otherwise Gordon was right about the film. Every seat in the place was filled and when we filed out, you could have heard a pin drop. I'd never seen a crowd leave a movie like that before.
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