The God Grab Bag

[Joe Sperling]

This thread is very funny. It seems reverse psychology is being used here to
try to get people to leave the board so the "nice" people are the ones re-
maining. It's a good method, very entertaining, and a good laugh also. And I
always enjoy a good laugh.

--Joe

[frank]

This thread is very funny. It seems reverse psychology is being used here to
try to get people to leave the board so the "nice" people are the ones re-
maining. It's a good method, very entertaining, and a good laugh also. And I
always enjoy a good laugh.

--Joe

It is kind of funny, isn't it?  It's funny in the sense that "nice" people can be so strong for their cause of "freedom" from tyranny.  It's also funny to watch people function out of character.  Yep, there's some funny stuff here, I will agree, Joe.

Freedom isn't free.

Frank

[2ram]

Enough already. JEM never called Tom a "tyrant". Verne made it seem like she did. End of story. Good grief, people.

DIdn't mean to ruffle your fur there, Scruffy.
You would have made a good leader in the good ole assembly days.  That tone, and that ability to know people's true motives.  My!!

2r

[frank]

Frank,

My house took a lot of damage in the 1994 Northridge earthquake.  I didn't have any where near the money it took to repair it, so I had to apply to FEMA for a SBA loan in order to raise the money to fix it.

The FEMA process was rational, requiring three detailed estimates from licensed contractors, and fairly quick.  It would have been very difficult to cheat the system they used. It took me about six months to get everything done.

Real estate values went down about 40% and it took about 5 years for them to recover fully.

As to the government handouts, I had to pay the loan back in full, with interest.

The FEMA guidline in the 94 case was that if the damage exceeded 60% of the replacement cost of the building, the owner could obtain a loan to have it demolished and rebuilt.

It was a case of a "helping hand, not a handout."

Thomas Maddux

Hi Tom,

FEMA guidelines, New Orleans rebuilding....this is nice chitchat, but I think there is a topic with much more urgency and relevance that you should speak to.  Have you been reading the posts lately?

Let me catch you up if you haven't read.  Many have expressed that they would like to see the older posters "old timers" take a break and let the new posters have a turn at it.  You were one that was specifically mentioned. 

If you have read - dead silence is your response?  Are you making a statement by not making a statement?  Do you feel that this is just another case where the leadership is being bugged/harrassed by the peons? or what 

You sure sound nice enough in this post, no complaint there, but it's that kangaroo sitting at the kitchen table that several would like to talk about.  Margaret directed a very good question toward you.  Can you please answer? 

Frank

[vernecarty]

Hi Tom,

FEMA guidelines, New Orleans rebuilding....this is nice chitchat, but I think there is a topic with much more urgency and relevance that you should speak to.  Have you been reading the posts lately?

Let me catch you up if you haven't read.  Many have expressed that they would like to see the older posters "old timers" take a break and let the new posters have a turn at it.  You were one that was specifically mentioned. 

If you have read - dead silence is your response?  Are you making a statement by not making a statement?  Do you feel that this is just another case where the leadership is being bugged/harrassed by the peons? or what 

You sure sound nice enough in this post, no complaint there, but it's that kangaroo sitting at the kitchen table that several would like to talk about.  Margaret directed a very good question toward you.  Can you please answer? 

Frank

This comment is not only uncivil, it is disorderly and betrays a lack of common courtesy.
Tom Maddux is not just an "old time" poster. He is a duly appointed board moderator.
Margaret's request of me was a fair one. Her request of Tom was entirely inappropriate. He is right to ignore it...and you.
Verne

[Scruffy]

DIdn't mean to ruffle your fur there, Scruffy.
You would have made a good leader in the good ole assembly days.  That tone, and that ability to know people's true motives.  My!!

2r

Oh no, my secret's out. I'm a former furry, psychic, bossy, head "saint".
NOT

[frank]

This comment is not only uncivil, it is disorderly and betrays a lack of common courtesy.
Tom Maddux is not just an "old time" poster. He is a duly appointed board moderator.
Margaret's request of me was a fair one. Her request of Tom was entirely inappropriate. He is right to ignore it...and you.
Verne

FEAR AND INTIMIDATION - a link from ga.com - http://www.howcultswork.com/

Cult leadership is feared. To disagree with leadership is the same as disagreeing with God. The cult leaders will claim to have direct authority from God to control almost all aspects of your life. If the cult is not a religious group then questioning the leaders or program will still be seen as a sign of rebellion and stupidity.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Frank,

I have deleted most of your post. 

The part I have left is just to show a sample of the ridiculous charges you have made.  To charge Verne with "cult control" is absurd.

You seem to have come here with no other purpose than to stir up trouble.

Stop it.  Now.

Thomas Maddux
Moderator

[Oscar]

Folks,

I think this would be a good time to re-post some thoughts I posted a few weeks ago.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


When Brian asked me to be a moderator he did not spell out any purpose, rules, or prohibitions for the board.  He just told me he trusted my judgement. He did not guarantee that he would always agree with me.   Since then he has intervened once, and that only to comment on my decision to delete a post by Dave Mauldin.  He did not overrule me.

Now, having a moderator at all implies that there are standards which should be observed.  So, we have had, (I believe) three moderators who have never agreed upon any standards for the board.

My own ideas are related to the purpose of the board.

It seems to me that the purpose of the board was/is/should be something like:

1. To inform people about the George Geftakys and his assemblies, including the teachings, practices, and inherent dangers.

2. To help people escape from those assemblies or to avoid becoming involved.

3. To help people recover from their involvement.  This can be accomplished by:

a. Answering questions and sharing experiences.

b. Discussing the subjects that arise as people re-establish their lives on a healthier basis.  This would include just about anything.  Religious beliefs are basic to most human behaviors, so we must explore how those beliefs apply to church polity, money, marriage and child raising, doctrinal teachings...even poker (I suppose). 

c. To provide a place of cyber-fellowship for those who have been in the assemblies or even other cultic groups.  (No, I don't think Dave M. should be excluded.  I just think he should behave himself.)

In light of the above, I don't think the board should be a place for attacking individuals for personal reasons. Strong disagreement is one thing.  Vituperation is another.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

These guidlines provide a wide range for all sorts of sharing of personal viewpoints of agreement or disagreement.

To turn the board into a forum for personal mud-slinging, however, is to divert it from any healthy purpose.

It would be appreciated if posters would try to stay within these parameters.

Thomas Maddux
Moderator

[hopon]

With due respect to your position here, I did not get a response from you in reference to my post below.

 Re: Constitution Studying
« Reply #49 on: September 09, 2005, 09:34:36 pm »     

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, Tom, I'm not seeing them [my last 5 posts] anywhere, not even on this thread itself, [in spite of the fact that you said they were still on this thread.]

Your request was stated exactly like this " Unless your thread generates some interest on the BB, I would suggest that you bring it to a close."

Now to me, it is a suggestion to consider, that if my thread doesn't generate interest in the near future, that I should bring it to a close. So, with respect to your suggestion, I posted my last 5 posts and another post to inform my captive audience that there would be no more to follow, but you deleted them.

You were not threatening to delete my posts, as you, or another moderator, had threatened Lenore with shortening, but never followed thru.

It may be of some interest to you, and this is probably the factor that got your religious fur up, that the motive for my postings was not to mock Lenore, although the comparison between a few of my posts and her method of posting was very similar. These similarities did make me chuckle and encouraged me to continue posting the longer posts in the way that I did.

Lenore's posts seem to be of value to you because of a few responses to them, BUT Lenore responded with interest to MY posts. Now, wouldn't that say something to you? Maybe MY posts are valuable to her. Maybe SHE would like to read them.

Do you really think that the average person, even if they were interested in reading the constitution, would admit that they enjoyed it? 

There have been many complaints about Lenore's method of posting and you did nothing about that situation. Many people beseeched her, to no avail. You did nothing.

Please give me the consideration of replacing the last 5 posts of mine that you deleted.
Regardless of what "acting like a troll" means in BB lingo, I find that offensive, especially since you don't refer to Lenore in the same way. Oh, I forgot, she has gotten more responses to her player piano paper rolls than I have.   
 
« Last Edit: September 09, 2005, 10:07:25 pm by hopon » 
 
May I add that Mauldin began many, many threads that most here ignored. Between him and Lenore, there have been times where the last 10 posts have belonged to only them. I have never reached that point.

Is it bothering you that I am posting anonymously?

To be frank (pun not intended), I thought that " Miss frankie" was referring to you when they posted the cult control information link, not Verne.

[vernecarty]

FEAR AND INTIMIDATION - a link from ga.com - http://www.howcultswork.com/

Cult leadership is feared. To disagree with leadership is the same as disagreeing with God. The cult leaders will claim to have direct authority from God to control almost all aspects of your life. If the cult is not a religious group then questioning the leaders or program will still be seen as a sign of rebellion and stupidity.

Here's the deal Ms. Frankie. I had every intention of taking an extended break as Margaret suggested. I really need it and so does the BB. 
I am confident that Tom will keep a watchful eye on the detritus.
I will stop posting...if you do the same.
By the way, I can see right through you so returning with an alias will do you no good.
Your aroma is too easy to detect. How about it?
Verne

p.s. I know I am mixing metaphors; perhaps I should have said that I can smell right through you huh? 

p.p.s Do you guys have any idea how all those negative points are inflating my ego? Keep 'em coming for it confirms my impact on you...will we get a special category for a positive/negative 1000 point combination?
May  I suggest  IMPACT POSTER EXTRAORDINARIE? Not even Brent comes close!     

[moonflower2]

Here's the deal Ms. Frankie. I had every intention of taking an extended break as Margaret suggested. I really need it and so does the BB. 
I am confident that Tom will keep a watchful eye on the detritus.
I will stop posting...if you do the same.
By the way, I can see right through you so returning with an alias will do you no good.
Your aroma is too easy to detect. How about it?
Verne

p.s. I know I am mixing metaphors; perhaps I should have said that I can smell right through you huh? 

p.p.s Do you guys have any idea how all those negative points are inflating my ego? Keep 'em coming for it confirms my impact on you...will we get a special category for a positive/negative 1000 point combination?
May  I suggest  IMPACT POSTER EXTRAORDINARIE? Not even Brent comes close!     

    

[2ram]

Folks,

I think this would be a good time to re-post some thoughts I posted a few weeks ago.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


When Brian asked me to be a moderator he did not spell out any purpose, rules, or prohibitions for the board.  He just told me he trusted my judgement. He did not guarantee that he would always agree with me.   Since then he has intervened once, and that only to comment on my decision to delete a post by Dave Mauldin.  He did not overrule me.

Now, having a moderator at all implies that there are standards which should be observed.  So, we have had, (I believe) three moderators who have never agreed upon any standards for the board.

My own ideas are related to the purpose of the board.

It seems to me that the purpose of the board was/is/should be something like:

1. To inform people about the George Geftakys and his assemblies, including the teachings, practices, and inherent dangers.

2. To help people escape from those assemblies or to avoid becoming involved.

3. To help people recover from their involvement.  This can be accomplished by:

a. Answering questions and sharing experiences.

b. Discussing the subjects that arise as people re-establish their lives on a healthier basis.  This would include just about anything.  Religious beliefs are basic to most human behaviors, so we must explore how those beliefs apply to church polity, money, marriage and child raising, doctrinal teachings...even poker (I suppose). 

c. To provide a place of cyber-fellowship for those who have been in the assemblies or even other cultic groups.  (No, I don't think Dave M. should be excluded.  I just think he should behave himself.)

In light of the above, I don't think the board should be a place for attacking individuals for personal reasons. Strong disagreement is one thing.  Vituperation is another.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

These guidlines provide a wide range for all sorts of sharing of personal viewpoints of agreement or disagreement.

To turn the board into a forum for personal mud-slinging, however, is to divert it from any healthy purpose.

It would be appreciated if posters would try to stay within these parameters.

Thomas Maddux
Moderator

Hi again Tom,

The problem is not with your parameters and guidelines, but in the way you moderate the BB within those parameters and guidelines.

For example:
You allow tenderhearted to post multiple and long boring posts but tell hopon that she cannot.  Possibly you and MarkC still view tenderhearted as being a weak sister.
You also allowed David M to start 106 threads, about double of the next most thread starter, but "fight" with skeptic when skeptic was successful in doing what you could(did??) not.
You say that, "Religious beliefs are basic to most human behaviors, so we must explore how those beliefs apply to...", but renege on that commitment when it is tenderhearted's POV that would need correcting, but not when it is Ruth or frank or hopon.

Yes, moderating a BB is a difficult task, but the added fact that you are unable to be on board and follow the discussions, makes your task doubly difficult, added to the fact that you are not entreatable.

I wish you all the best.
2r

[Oscar]

Hello folks,

Ever hear of "Deja Vu?" 

I have done some laughing as I have read my fanmail for the past few days.  You see, I recognized an old game being played that took me back to the 70's and 80's.

I will explain.

I taught elementary school for about 20 years.  During that time I was called on to participate in this game many times. 

The name of the game, at that level, is called "Manipulating teacher".

It works like this....lets say that Mary wants to "get" Billy for some reason that seems important to Mary.  The problem is that Mary is not allowed to "get" Billy.   But Teacher is!

So, Mary goes to work to manipulate Teacher into doing what she wants.  Usually this is not very easy to do. 

BUT, there is one strategy that usually works.

Mary observes Billy until she sees Billy do something that she expects Teacher to correct.  If Teacher fails to disicipline Billy to Mary's satisfaction, She then utters the following Words of Power, before which parents and teachers rarely fail to quail.

"THAT'S NOT FAIR", When Howard did X you did Y, and now you didn't punish Billy the same."

When it dawned on my that exactly the same tactic was being used on me here, I was both surprised and amused.

My imagination?  Well.....

You allow tenderhearted to post multiple and long boring posts but tell hopon that she cannot.  Possibly you and MarkC still view tenderhearted as being a weak sister.

and...

There have been many complaints about Lenore's method of posting and you did nothing about that situation. Many people beseeched her, to no avail. You did nothing.

Sure looks like the same game to me.   

However, when I was "Teacher" I never allowed the "Mary's" of my classrooms win at this game and I don't intend to be manipulated by their older sisters either.

The answer to the manipulative child (or adult) is to point out that their behavior and "Billy's" is different in detail and circumstance.

Disrupting the board with huge posts as a method of "getting" someone or manipulating someone is not nice.

Neither are ugly personal attacks when you don't get your way.

Perhaps you two should listen to your "better angels."

Thomas Maddux

[hopon]

Hello folks,

Ever hear of "Deja Vu?" 

I have done some laughing as I have read my fanmail for the past few days.  You see, I recognized an old game being played that took me back to the 70's and 80's.

I will explain.

I taught elementary school for about 20 years.  During that time I was called on to participate in this game many times. 

The name of the game, at that level, is called "Manipulating teacher".

It works like this....lets say that Mary wants to "get" Billy for some reason that seems important to Mary.  The problem is that Mary is not allowed to "get" Billy.   But Teacher is!

So, Mary goes to work to manipulate Teacher into doing what she wants.  Usually this is not very easy to do. 

BUT, there is one strategy that usually works.

Mary observes Billy until she sees Billy do something that she expects Teacher to correct.  If Teacher fails to disicipline Billy to Mary's satisfaction, She then utters the following Words of Power, before which parents and teachers rarely fail to quail.

"THAT'S NOT FAIR", When Howard did X you did Y, and now you didn't punish Billy the same."

When it dawned on my that exactly the same tactic was being used on me here, I was both surprised and amused.

My imagination?  Well.....

and...

Sure looks like the same game to me.   

However, when I was "Teacher" I never allowed the "Mary's" of my classrooms win at this game and I don't intend to be manipulated by their older sisters either.

The answer to the manipulative child (or adult) is to point out that their behavior and "Billy's" is different in detail and circumstance.

Disrupting the board with huge posts as a method of "getting" someone or manipulating someone is not nice.

Most posters including you Tom, assumed that I had posted the posts in mockery of Lenore. I think you may have given me credit now on that one. But now you are deducing and assuming that I was hoping for a "spanking" for Lenore. You are assuming that I in some way may have manipulated someone else to pressure Master Tom? Not on your life.

My reasons for posting had nothing to do with Lenore. But of course you are a teacher and teachers don't have to be entreated by students for any reason. After all, teachers are in charge and teachers are always right, right?

Teachers need to keep up that wall of perfection and authority or students may begin to think and all hell will break loose!

In Master Maddux's class Lenore needs to be coddled because she is substandard in some way and rules that apply to the rest of us don't apply to her.  Maybe we should start a Special Ed thread?

Anyway back to the real issue.

You had NOT asked me to stop posting as you incorrectly stated in a previous post and I will copy again what you did say. In fact, because you fail to be entreated, I will post the entire PM:

Hopon,

I think you have made your point about repeated long posts about whatever. 

Your thread does not seem to have generated much interest, however.

In the case of Lenore, the long post champion, there are some who actually read them and say they enjoy some of it.

Unless your thread generates some interest on the BB, I would suggest that you bring it to a close.

Thomas Maddux
Moderator

Now to me, this is not a request to immediately stop posting.
I posted only 4 more times and within minutes you had DELETED them.

Master Tom, that is like a slap in the face or an immediate "F" written on my paper without you having even read it AND you assuming that you knew my motives for writing the paper!

You bring up a past analogy? Let me bring one up too.

Master Tom, I have been in classes such as yours and found them to be extremely boring. You lack vision and entreatability. You pigeon-hole students and interact with them accordingly. There is only one way of thinking and that is yours. Students with brains are sleeping or staring out the window but they are the incorrigible ones of course.  Hopefully the only class you ever taught was ENGLISH GRAMMAR.

Neither are ugly personal attacks when you don't get your way.

I have not attacked you personally. You have attacked me.

By deleting my posts in the way that you did, you have slapped me in the face. By refering to my way of posting as "acting like a Troll" you have held me up above any other longer winded poster and insulted me and made me a teacher's example of "this is what happens to.........."

Perhaps you two should listen to your "better angels."

Perhaps you don't have one?

Thomas Maddux

P.S. I'm beginning to believe that miss frankie has a valid point regarding control. There doesn't seem to be any other logical way to look at it.

You can't control a student who has a mask on. 

AND:

There are other ways of attempting to change the tenor of a Bulletin Board besides tacking up a student's picture and making marks on it with Magic Marker. Ah....the sweet smell of power.......
Speaking of manipulations...........
 

[brian]

I find it interesting that when natural disasters strike, there are those who proclaim, "This was God's judgement!" It seems to happen every time something terrible happens: 9/11, the tsunami, and now Hurricane Katrina.

yeah, when i heard about NO, one of my thoughts was along these lines. some fanatics will sieze on this and point at the french quarter (which is still standing) as the sinful source of god's judgement. but what about all the small towns that got hit much harder by the hurricane along 50 miles of coastline in mississippi? were they more sinful than the french quarter, since they were demolished and it is still standing? religious fervor often makes ignoring facts fun and easy.

brian