The God Grab Bag

[Joe Sperling]

Meeko---

This is in response to your post below, and is not a "diversion" away from the
subject. I just have a question for you: Do you really believe the Holy Spirit is
the one leading you to call Tom an "unbeliever", and to make the charge he
has "insulted the Holy Spirit"? That's a pretty serious charge. I mean this as
a serious question.

--Joe

[Joe Sperling]

Meeko---

Sorry to butt in again, and I'll make this quick. Your post below is filled with your
deep feelings, and I don't take that away from you. But I have to say "Thank God
for the theologians" that truly know, and correctly divide the Word of truth. There
have been many, many people who have truly believed that God is talking to them,
and that they are having a "two-way conversation" with God.

Many of these people were deeply sincere, but sincerely wrong, and drifted into heresy
because of their beliefs. It took Theologians with their "dead theology" to point out these
people to other believers. Many Christian cults have begun when someone really believes
they have "cleaned house" and are having direct contact with the Lord. It's great to feel
that God and yourself are on completely personal terms, and you are thinking like him, but
many have thought the same way and drifted into terrible error.

That's why I asked you the question I did below, which so far has not been answered(unless you
are posting right now as I am posting). So, I'll ask it again. Do you really believe that you are being
led by the Holy Spirit to call Tom an "unbeliever", and to say he has "insulted the Holy Spirit"? I
am truly curious as to what your answer would be.

****addition*** I see your latest post and have to say you didn't answer the question. I'm not defending Tom--Tom can defend himself. I am not "forming a team" or "standing behind someone
else". I am boldly asking you a direct question on my own. I don't think you can answer in the affirmative, because if you were in the Spirit you would not accuse another person of being an "unbeliever" and having "insulted the Holy Spirit" who has often displayed their faith in God on
this BB. You see yourself as being so spiritual that you can say or refer or accuse anyone of anything
based on your "discernment". Tom is not a believer based on your "discernment". Funny--I "discerned"
a long time ago that Tom is a genuine believer, and he has posted often about his faith in Christ---search the archives--search the threads, before making an accusation that is so off base.

--Joe

[vernecarty]

but the basic Truth is that God inhabits His people - walks in them, talks with them, directs their lives.  It is upon the believer to go forward and learn what that means and learn to distinguish His voice from that of another. 

Meeko

This is a precious truth that the sad experience of the assemblies has destroyed in the lives of many of God's precious flock- we have forgotten Who dwells within...
Verne

[matthew r. sciaini]

Meeko:

This is not about taking sides, so....

I think you have gone over the top in calling Tom an unbeliever.  Just because you don't like or you disagree with what he is saying is no reason to say that he is not a Christian. 

Matt Sciaini

[Elizabeth H]

Meeko,

I don't agree with everything Tom says. I also don't like how Tom says some things. But you know what? There are times when Tom does say some pretty darn insightful things. And as he demonstrated earlier this afternoon, when he is wrong, he says "mea culpa." His "sorry" may be in Latin, but it was good enough for Verne, why isn't it good enough for you?

Joe was right. It is inappropriate to accuse someone of being an unbeliever. Period. First of all, no matter what your reasons, you will never be able to prove this empirically or spiritually; only God knows Tom's spiritual state. To accuse him of being an unbeliever in this public forum is simply vulgar and makes your intentions on this board suspect. Thirdly, most of us have no reason to doubt Tom is a believer, in fact we probably all consider Tom a very firm believer.

I am quite aware that because I have said this, you will now find some way to try and discredit me. Go ahead, call me an unbeliever. Make personal attacks. Say I'm like George. Say I'm acting like a Geftakys. That don't scare me none, I've been dealing with that since birth, honey.

And Frankly, Meeko, your Ruthless pursuit of Al & Verne and whoever else you may disagree with is just plain annoying. Sondrock it off, already!

[moonflower2]

Joe,

Tom does not talk about the Lord.  Someone who does not talk about the Lord does not know the Lord.  For someone who speaks on as many topics as Tom does, one would think that his walk with God would come up.  I have read that you speak of loving God, and many others.  This is the 'rain gauge' I keep out....

Meeko

And since we had a "rain guage" on you, these following quotes from one of your posts were quite a surprise, franko/meeko/affirming/Ruth/etc:

One can just as easily be deceived and controlled by objectivity as he can through subjectivity if they are objectively outside of the Truth that is in Christ..

is really difficult to believe that so many learned scholars of the Bible can be so void of Truth (Christ).

Christ is ......Christ Himself.......Christ........the Son of God

I don't believe that in all your BB posts that you have ever directly mentioned Christ. You have described much of your spiritual life, but I don't recall you mentioning Christ.

I could have made the same judgement of you that you have made of Tom, in that because you have posted so much on this BB (and deleted the same) and haven't mentioned Christ, that you were bypassing the Truth of the gospel and were marching to your own gospel, however spiritual it may be.

In the above quote, you have said that after all his postings, Tom hasn't talked about his walk with God and hasn't talked about the Lord. You could make a judgement, but to make the judgement call that Tom doesn't know the Lord, because he doesn't talk about the Lord or his walk with God on a public BB, is far-fetched in my opinion.

[al Hartman]

There are no real clubs, Joe, even in Christ.  Each person was born with his own life and was given a couple legs with which to carry themselves around in this world.  The rest is up to the individual.  Find your own legs and stand on them and let other people stand on theirs - would be my best advice to you, Joe.  You are strong, but you always want to form teams and stand behind someone else.

Have you heard the one about the "Body of Christ?"  Goes like this:  This guy named Paul says to a bunch of Christians, "Now you are the body of Christ, and members in particular..."

No, wait-- I always get this turned around-- before he says that, Paul says, "For as the body is one, and has many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ."  Then he goes into a big illustration of how it works so that no member of the body is self-sufficient, and all the members need each other in order to make up the whole body.  He even goes as far as to say, "...those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary:
And those members of the body, which we think of as being less honorable, upon these we bestow more abundant honor; and our unattractive parts have more abundant attractiveness."

Aw, I'm not telling this very well...  Most of you have probably already heard it anyway, and some folks probably wouldn't get it no matter how well it was told...

The gist of it is:  Don't feel like the Lone Ranger, 'cause you aren't.

al

[2ram]

Interesting!

meeko, for the record, I disagree with you re. your accusation that Tom is an unbeliever.  I am impressed with how many have voiced their disagreement in defense of Tom, but allowed Tom to suggest that frank was demon possessed and a medium.  Maybe everyone's afraid of Tom and/or still giving him the benefit of the doubt?

Marcia

P.S.
On another note, meeko so e.g. if the Bible says that I should gather with other Christians because it is healthy for spiritual growth, how would you feel that the Spirit is leading you?

Marcia

[al Hartman]

Guess what, folks?

Meeko has left the building.  Still registered but showing "0" posts.  Too hot in the kitchen, or did God say "Burn your bridges?"

I don't see that so many have defended Tom as have simply objected to his having been treated in a Christ-dishonoring way.  A number of posters have treated Tom worse than they were accusing him of treating others, and Tom has not lashed back at them.  The one or two who may have had legitimate gripes about how Tom addressed them have become poster-kids for martyrdom.

Anybody want to talk about something else for awhile?

[Gabe]

Meeko,

I don't agree with everything Tom says. I also don't like how Tom says some things. But you know what? There are times when Tom does say some pretty darn insightful things. And as he demonstrated earlier this afternoon, when he is wrong, he says "mea culpa." His "sorry" may be in Latin, but it was good enough for Verne, why isn't it good enough for you?

Joe was right. It is inappropriate to accuse someone of being an unbeliever. Period. First of all, no matter what your reasons, you will never be able to prove this empirically or spiritually; only God knows Tom's spiritual state. To accuse him of being an unbeliever in this public forum is simply vulgar and makes your intentions on this board suspect. Thirdly, most of us have no reason to doubt Tom is a believer, in fact we probably all consider Tom a very firm believer.

I am quite aware that because I have said this, you will now find some way to try and discredit me. Go ahead, call me an unbeliever. Make personal attacks. Say I'm like George. Say I'm acting like a Geftakys. That don't scare me none, I've been dealing with that since birth, honey.

And Frankly, Meeko, your Ruthless pursuit of Al & Verne and whoever else you may disagree with is just plain annoying. Sondrock it off, already!

Hey Elizabeth,

Since you assumed that Meeko is Sondra:

How about not addressing women twice your age as "honey"? It's not cute, and it's pretty low class.

That's cute that you used the double negative in "dont' scare me none" - I suppose that's a jab at her rural, midwestern roots. Too bad we can't all be Californians like you, huh? Ever had to shovel snow? Ever had to swat a mosquito? Wait, probably using words you've never heard of....just another hip Californian who has never had to do any kind of physical labor in her life.

Here's another thought: The bb was not designed to entertain Elizabeth Geftakys Henderson. You are old enough now to accept that people are not going to see things the way you do. The fact is, I have enjoyed Meeko's, 2Rams, Verne's, Marty's, Frank's, and others contributions and have learned a lot from their insights. I don't want any of them to "knock it off" because Queen Elizabeth is "annoyed" especially when she has the ability to skim over posts from posters she doesn't like.

Lastly, Tom, Verne, and others have all accused people of not being believers - and even worse - of being tools of Satan. So, I'm sure they don't agree with you that it's a "vulgar" thing to do. Oops, bet you forgot about that one, honey!

Gabriel

[2ram]

Gabe,

Since you mentioned my name I will comment.
The tone of your post is brutal.  Who am I to talk eh??  Well you did say you liked my contribution....

Please cool it!

Marcia
(not the moderator)

[Gabe]

Gabe,

Since you mentioned my name I will comment.
The tone of your post is brutal.  Who am I to talk eh??  Well you did say you liked my contribution....

Please cool it!

Marcia
(not the moderator)

Yes, of course, Miss Marcia

For you, anything!

I like the comparison between your tone and Elizabeth's/mine. Elizabeth is actually right around my age...and I guess we show our age in our intemperate outbursts. Hopefully one day we will be as calm and restrained as you!

Still love you much,
Gabriel

[Oscar]

Hello Folks,

There are many things to talk about besides my spiritual condition and who we happen to like/dislike. Why don't we lay those subjects aside and focus on more interesting things.  But first a couple of specifics.

1. Sondra, if you wish to continue your participation on the BB, stop your personal attacks.  I have allowed you plenty of time to express your views on my spiritual condition.  You have done so quite well.  The supply is now adequate.  Please desist from your personal attacks on me and on the other posters.

2. Gabe, the tone of your post to Elizabeth was aggressive and insulting.  Don't.

Blessings,

Thomas Maddux
Moderator

[Oscar]

Guess what, folks?

Meeko has left the building.  Still registered but showing "0" posts.  Too hot in the kitchen, or did God say "Burn your bridges?"

I don't see that so many have defended Tom as have simply objected to his having been treated in a Christ-dishonoring way.  A number of posters have treated Tom worse than they were accusing him of treating others, and Tom has not lashed back at them.  The one or two who may have had legitimate gripes about how Tom addressed them have become poster-kids for martyrdom.

Anybody want to talk about something else for awhile?

Al, on your posts it says, "Ancora Imparo".  Does that mean, "My anchor is impaired?"

[brian]

Hey Elizabeth,

Since you assumed that Meeko is Sondra:

How about not addressing women twice your age as "honey"? It's not cute, and it's pretty low class.

That's cute that you used the double negative in "dont' scare me none" - I suppose that's a jab at her rural, midwestern roots. Too bad we can't all be Californians like you, huh? Ever had to shovel snow? Ever had to swat a mosquito? Wait, probably using words you've never heard of....just another hip Californian who has never had to do any kind of physical labor in her life.

Here's another thought: The bb was not designed to entertain Elizabeth Geftakys Henderson. You are old enough now to accept that people are not going to see things the way you do. The fact is, I have enjoyed Meeko's, 2Rams, Verne's, Marty's, Frank's, and others contributions and have learned a lot from their insights. I don't want any of them to "knock it off" because Queen Elizabeth is "annoyed" especially when she has the ability to skim over posts from posters she doesn't like.

Lastly, Tom, Verne, and others have all accused people of not being believers - and even worse - of being tools of Satan. So, I'm sure they don't agree with you that it's a "vulgar" thing to do. Oops, bet you forgot about that one, honey!

Gabriel

could this kind of sneering, insulting, argumentative tone possibly be matt, who has been openly banned here for such behavior in the past? your ip shows you were also posting under the frank account, which would appear to be an account a few people were sharing. given matt's close association with sondra in the past, its a leap i am willing to risk. i am sick of these stupid games. your ip is banned and the frank account is banned. whoever else was using the frank account can sign up under whatever fake name they feel the need to, as long as they keep their posting civil. you guys only embarass yourselves playing these kinds of childish games in front of everyone.

i'm not gonna waste my time scrutinizing every account to see if more than one person is using it. but if you decide to share your account information with others in order to play these kinds of games, that will become clear pretty quickly and you should expect to lose it.