Stand up for the VICTIMS!

[editor]

Quite right Garth!

Hmmmmm....are promotions in order?  

[Toni Fuller]

Brent,  good post!  I think we all know it's gonna take time for all of this to fan out.  What are some things that all of us can do??  I'm open to suggestions,  I  was involved in St.Louis for over 20 yrs.  I'd like to do whatever I can.  

[Rob Kazarinoff]

For anybody who's goal it is to have a sound beliefs and clear thoughts, nothing is more helpful than adverse criticism.  It's called REALITY. However, there is a state of mind that continues to hold on to and refuses to question it's perspective in spite of the clear evidence presented by adverse critics.  It's called DELUSION.

Christ came speaking the TRUTH.  It was religious men who refused to own they were lost and separated themselves from Him by their system of religion.  These men, looked up to by others as leaders, were told that harlots and tax collectors had better hopes of heaven than themselves.

"How often would I have gathered thy children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and AND YE WOULD NOT."

Again, the term is DELUSION

[Heide]

Awesome post Rob! It is so good that I almost hate to write anything... But....

Keep telling the truth, over and over. Just because one brother has stepped down out of leadership doesn't mean it stops. There are stories to be told and anytime one person tells his/her story it isn't gossip. It is something to be reckoned with. If you have left the assembly and gone some place else don't be quiet, tell people there is a christian cult in the area. If you don't talk, you assume responsibility for what happened. Evil hides in the darkness, evil hides when people don't want to talk.

Today, tell your story to a friend. Remind people what happened. List the names, talk!

Heide

[Eulaha L. Long]

BRAVO HEIDE!  BRAVO ROB!

[Heide]

I still haven't heard an honest reply from Jeff or Roberto.

 -Walk with me down history lane. It's 1993-1994 Greg Holder has witnessed something terrible and there is a meeting. Not only are the leading brothers there BUT there wives. I call out Jenny Sanchez and Nancy Lemkuhl as well as your husbands. You were present at the second meeting and you heard first hand about the abuse. What did you do? Over the next few years did you think about befriending Judy (not to be meddlesome, out of sincere friendship) or did you just claim to be a coward? I've been thinking about this all morning, what were you waiting for? Blood splatter on the wall? Nancy and Jenny, you both need to be aware that I hold you accountable.

Heide Johnson

[AaBbCc]

Heide,

Nancy & Jenny are  the wives of leading brothers in SLO.  They are victims of abuse themselves.  I saw it with my own eyes when I was in fellowship in SLO from 1985-1990.

The definition of a wife in assembly terms:
1)  Husband is NEVER WRONG
2)  Wife is no more than a slave to her husband
3)  The wife must back her husband - NO MATTER WHAT!
4)  Wife is to remain silent
5)  The wife can do nothing right

Do you really expect Nancy and Jenny are even allowed to read this website?  

Do you think they would dare come out and say that their husbands abuse them?  What do you think Jeff and Roberto would do to their wives?

Love ya,
Lori

[brad]

What or who is running things in SLO...I was under the impression that Danny Edwards had recently moved to be in leadership there? Is that true....?

If it is true, from his post earlier he is not adverse to showing true humility and repentance and ACCOUNTABILITY with the local church. Is it possible that due to late arrival and his potential innocence (since he was not there until recently) in this SLO issue..that maybe some healing and restoration could occur including a exposure of this obviously Violent church body....?

I have to hope that GOD can and will continue to expose these sicking tales of violence and abuse and allow any sincere folks a chance to move on...

Moved to tears by these tales...and wondering "how" these could have become so common in one locale... How many others and in how many places was this occuring? WE NEED TO KNOW  

[jackhutchinson]

Brad,

How great to hear from you!  You may not remember me, but I was on the MTT to Providence in 1987.  I think you and I rode in Joe Busch's green van.  I just escaped the assembly prison/assylum last week.  I'm glad to see you're doing great.

I know something went down in Tuscola in the '80's, but nobody discussed it openly (and most certainly not honestly).  I heard the usual "those people (Mathias's) really caused problems and divisions" garbage.

Lori,

In light of the subject matter of this thread, you might want to give some specific details about abuse in other families in SLO.  If there are wives and children suffering abuse we need to help them by exposing the darkness specifically.  Besides, if some of the SLO LB's decide to "repent" of the David G cover-up and ignore their own abuse, some might be fooled.  You can't get rid of ivy by pulling out the leaves.  You've got to get all the roots and then some.

Jack

[psalm51]

Lori and Heide,
Please, please. Do you really want reconciliation? Do you really want to  help? These women do not need your vitriole right now. They need your prayers and your compassion. Their families need healing, not suggestion, innuendo, and bitter words. Have a little mercy on hurting, bruised people.
You need mercy too, don't you?
Pat (Nancy's sister)

[brad]

Jack....amazing and wonderful. Would love to hear your story...share what you can.

I just got off my private email from a guy in Canada..named Chris Burgess..he has pictures of that very MTT trip. I expect he will be contacting you as he frequently monitors this site. He has a great group photo of everyone and is trying to ID their names...you are right in there.

Peace my brother and let the light shine so the healing can begin...

[Heide]

Pat & Lori,

I understand where you are coming from but both of these women played a part in what happened. All I am asking is that they own up to there actions. I can't get this out of my head that it was all the men's fault. Yes, the wives followed accordingly but in their hearts they made choices. They might both be victims but what about other women that they victimized? Both could have refrained from making comments but they didn't. Healing happens when you repent of the sin in your heart.  Healing happens when all this darkness comes to light. It took Judy a tremendous amount of courage to write her own story of how she was victimized but she also took responsibility for her own actions. That is all that I am asking for. Healing starts at home when both parties can repent. So far Jeff's actions to me have not been sincere. There is no suggestions, innuedo's or bitter words here just honesty. I believe Jeff and Roberto to be most of the problem so far but I also know how I was treated by these women. Before the families can be healed they must acknowledge the truth. I was the one your brother in law referred to as a liar when I told the truth about the abuse that I saw. Until there is repentance I will not back down nor offer a fast fix. I would love reconciliation but at what cost?
Heide
P.S. What does vitriole mean?

[Heide]

I remember what I forgot to say Lori, there are exceptions to your rule. I don't believe that every woman who is married got beaten in the assembly. I believe there are couples out there who went against the system and actually appreciated their wives and cherished them. It always seemed to me (I hope who I name don't mind...) the Foy's, Cantrell's, Tr0ckman's, Cesaretti's and Steepleton's had really awesome marriages with no bouts of abuse. I think there are others. Pat, if you are trying to tell me your sister is in a bad place and I need to back off, be more specific.

I'm stepping off my soapbox now it is starting to get mushy!

[psalm51]

Heide, I have sent you a private message.
Pat

[AaBbCc]

Heide,

The abuse I am talking about is the mental abuse.  The controlling type of abuse.  I do not think it is possible to be married in the assembly and not receive the controlling type of abuse all the way down to the finest detail or what I call the "so whats".  Control type abuse was what was prevalent.   Control was what was taught!

I also believe that the amount of abuse suffered was directly proportionate to the amount of counsel received.

I know of the Foy's personally.  Sheila did not want ungodly counsel by David Geftaky's and refused it.  She seemed to have been spared - Praise God for her following her OWN conscience!

Control was what was taught!!!  I remember a story by a sister who was going on a "date" with a brother.  The date consisted of being taken to a bookstore.  The brother was told by the LB's to take the sister to the bookstore.  If she stays by your side i.e. follows you around in the store that is good.  If she wanders off to look at books that she is interested in, that is bad.  The sister failed the test.  Come on, get real!  

I go in bookstores all the time with my husband.  It is one of our favorite things to do.  He goes straight for the engineering books and I go to the Christian books - so what!  

The abuse I am talking about are the "so whats"!  Why in the world is it necessary to control your wife all the way down to the "so whats"?  What to cook, what to wear, what to iron, what to clean.  Do this, do that, you didn't do that right etc.  This meal is lousy, change your clothes, you didn't iron this shirt good enough, look at that spot of water on the bathroom sink.  Don't you think a woman should be allowed to make ANY DECISIONS for herself?  Can't you trust your wife?  Are you that insecure? (Don't read Proverbs 31 - that does not apply in the assembly).

I have talked to several married couples that have left the assembly and they assured me that things are SO MUCH BETTER NOW!  Well no wonder - dah.  Their husbands are no longer receiving ungodly counsel by the LB's on how to control their wife.

Lori