What God wishes the Assembly knew about Christianity

[Arthur]

Dan, I came across this from one of John Malone's old posts.  Is Mark Sjogren related to you?

Chuck Miller, who led his wife and 9 children out of Romanism, and to faith in Jesus Christ, began having a handful or two of mostly ex-Roman Catholics into his home for the study of Scripture, and for remembrance of the Lord's death in his appointed way.

I was not among them, and received this information from Chuck and Mary Ann Miller a couple of years ago, following their 50th wedding anniversary. Shortly after this small gathering of former Catholics (and former Pentecostals) began to meet together, Mike Zach met George Geftakys through Walt Stanky of Norfolk, Nebraska.

George provided Mike an opportunity to rival the superior age of Chuck Miller, and Chuck, being an affable fellow, welcomed George's "experience" and "leadership." According to Chuck, "I should have known, when George told us to quit breaking bread until he came back, that he was up to no good. There was no reason for us to stop doing what we knew the Lord commands."

Indeed, the slide into Georgism, Lodgism, and Geftakysitis was on the way. George began to take over, and sent Jim Hayman to secure the Lodge along its way.

About 2 years after Hayman's appearane - Jim did most of the preaching - Chuck Miller decided to stop selling insurance. He and Zach sold together, ostensibly, but the fact is neither of them sold much. Zach disagreed with Chuck working with his hands instead of selling insurance, and quickly swung George to his side.

With George, Jim and Mike against Chuck's liberty to work as he chose, it was not long before he became an offender, especially when he said, "I don't care what George thinks about this, the Lord wants me to do something else." Then he did the unthinkable: he slammed his hand on a table, for emphasis!

Not only did Chuck and MaryAnn Miller become persona non grata but their post-high-school single children except Patty went to "summer school" in Fullerton, and never returned to their home, separating themselves by 1,700 miles from their parents.

This was blatant manipulation of the Miller family by Zach and Geftakys, and Jim Hayman was the one who sold it to the rest of us in Omaha. Jim soon began to get ill, and that illness or weakness lasted well after he returned to the Goleta are, in SoCal.

Mike Zach propped up Mark Sjogren to be a "co-leading brother" with him, and the fact that Mark was Chuck Miller's son-in-law, and that Chuck's oldest daughter Patty would just shake her head about her father, pretty much certified to the rest of us that Chuck must have some serious problem. He determined - like so many erroneously do - to not discuss his viewpoint with those who asked him.

It was a tragic mistake.

[Bob Sturnfield]

When I exited 4 weeks ago, after 28 years in the assemblies, I was of the opinion that the doctrine was correct, it just was not practiced.

I am still just starting to see things, but currently I believe that like Scofield said about Revelation 2:6,15 What in Ephesus was deeds, had  become in Pergamos a doctrine.

Prayerfully consider where doctrine was used to justify:

• pride
• proud and untrained men in authority
• absolute authority of leadership
• leadership that is not accountable to anyone
• separating ones from their natural family
• fathers not spending time with their children
• husbands failing to talk to and listen to their wives
• spouse and child abuse both physical and verbal
• unqualified counselors and then preventing ones from receiving needed psychological counseling
• bad counsel overruling your conscience
• elitism
• separation from rest of the Body of Christ
• disagreement and criticism treated as divisiveness
• gossip, especially at workers' meetings
• slandering ones that have left
• controlling mainly the outer appearance
• intolerance
• making ones an offender for using the wrong word
• acceptance based on performance
• motivating out of fear
• pressuring ones
• hectic schedules
• judging ones based on meeting attendance
• funds misused or not accounted for
• sending funds off to the "work" when there were needs at home

Even if you do not believe "any" of this applies to where you were, there may be others (such as me) that need to repent of allowing these things.

2 Peter 3:16b which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

[Oscar]

Regarding the book, "Churches that Abuse" by Enroth.

I have heard over the years that the standard assembly line on this book is that it is "all lies".  

I was an eyewitness to many of the incidents in this book and it is NOT all lies.  

The young man that wanted to be a police officer was Art Zamora.

The main character, Kyle Larson, is fictitious, as Enroth says.  He is a composite of the stories of Dennis Patrick and Kurt Green.

There is one line about me.  "Those who fell from favor, particularly the older members who persisted in questioning his teaching and authority, were ostracized and ridiculed."
Yup.  That wasn't much fun.  But I would like to point out that I never met Enroth until AFTER the book was written.  This is what he was told in interviews with others.  They got it right though.

So, I can personally testify that these are not lies, that the book portrays real events about real people.  

So one can see that accusations about GG's teachings and practices are not just "generalizations".  They are true, and most of them were in place from the very beginning.

Thomas Maddux

[Ron Johnson]

Bob it's sad but true.  Those things were taught and practiced.

I did'nt learn the truth about the Body of Christ until I left the group.

RJ

[freebird]

Dan and others,

I realize that many people are indeed "wounded pilgrims" at this time.  Therefore I can be entreatable toward my sarcasm.  So, I honestly looked over my list with an attitude to change or delete whatever I thought was inappropriate.  As you all can see, I have changed nothing.  Now let me explain.

Here is my burden:  Gal. 5:1  "Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage."

I originally posted these "thoughts" as a way to get others to think about what they were experiencing and being taught in the assemblies.  I reposted with the concern that none of the issues (practice and doctrine) would be addressed, allowing for further abuse.  

If any are offended, please don't take it personal.  These are directed more toward the "system" that governed the assemblies.  When I left 3 years ago (before any of the recent trouble has emerged), I noticed many unhealthy teachings and practices.  I am not throwing stones here.  I am trying to help people to begin to think and act in healthy ways.  

Please give me a chance, you might find that I am on your side.

Garth

[ptemplin7]

Garth,

I agree. They really aren't personal attacks but instead things and truths that were espoused in various forms and methods.

These simple statements seem like over generalizations yet they are really the end result of much of what was taught.

Remember as well that there were many other great things taught. Let's make sure we don't throws the baby out with the bathwater. Just as in Corith. There were massive problems yet Paul was able to commend them on some things they managed to get right. And we see that after the major problems were dealt with that the gathering there can out stronger and healthier than before.

Garth I had to chuckle the first time I read the list because like it or not this is what was taught or if not taught, practiced. I think that some on the inside still have not really had it "practiced" on them. This makes it very difficult to see the truth of many of the statements. It takes perspective that one doesn't have until stepping back from situation.

I think that many of the "thoughts" are indeed being openly challenged now and will continue to be.

The process of discovery is painful but it does lead to openness and light at the end. Including blessing and freedom that only our God and Father can give.

On the path of greater freedom too, Paris Templin