The Robinsons have hurt the flock

[MGov]

My faults are many MGov, don't you dare compare me to that spiritual monster...
Verne

Forgive me Verne; that last 'jab' was unnecesssary, I went too far with that one.

M

[MGov]

Looks like the Robinsons are destined to be famous.
We just finished with the Why Luke R... thread, and now we have this one started today and already with 4 pages of replies.
M

[St. Louis sister]

Hello dear ones,
I see that I have offended a lot of people, many of whom I care dearly for (Teaters, Dodoricos, Andrea Denner, Verne Carty). I've met each and every one of you and I don't want there to be this discontent between us. You are right that I should not have posted anonymously. However, I was only pointing out the specific brother that Verne was alluding too. I did not make anything up. Jerry Robinson left the assembly with a note rather than addressing the assembly. I mentioned my personal feelings on the Robinsons. How they treated me may not be how they treated you, and so it might be hard for you to understand where I'm coming from. I have good reason to remain anonymous though. There is too much bitterness, too much name-calling hatred on this board and in the assembly situations. I can't take it any more. I'd also like to mention that I'm against spreading rumors like Tony Edwards apparently has (he's not said anything to me, but I know there is a commotion going on here because of some false comments he's made). My main problem was with Jerry Robinson leaving us without any guidance in the midst of turmoil. He's a very gifted man and he could have done a lot to help the saints out. Instead, he did slink away...maybe not as a rat, but as a man. He has not been held accountable for this damage that it did to the saints. He placed his comfort and his life before those of the saints he shepherded. He's not an innocent man. Thank you for listening.

And please do not send any emails. That is a fake email that I made up a few years ago to use on forms for shopping online. That way I'd not get junk mail in my real email.  I will not answer any emails sent there.

[vernecarty]

To Verne:

don't you dare compare me to that spiritual monster...

According to the bible one sin isn't greater than the other, they are all the same, that puts you in the same boat with him.  Since when did you become a "better" man?  I think someone needs to check his pride-o-meter.

O.K. Mark I admit I am a little sensitive about being compared to GG but do you really think my own failures carry as much impact as his? To whom much is given, much is required. My own failures notwithstanding, I can say with great confidence I am nothing like that man, God's mercies be praised...
Verne
p.s. your dad is one of the kindest, gentlest men I have ever met...

[MGov]

STL sister,

What about Private messages on this BB?  will you be checking those?

M

[St. Louis sister]

Eulaha,
I found your message to the Robinson boys inappropriate. You did not show them love in your post and they are going through a hard time. Let it be known that I did not agree with this woman (Eulaha).

[vernecarty]

Hello dear ones,
I see that I have offended a lot of people, many of whom I care dearly for (Teaters, Dodoricos, Andrea Denner, Verne Carty).

I was in no way offended by anything you said sister.

My main problem was with Jerry Robinson leaving us without any guidance in the midst of turmoil. He's a very gifted man and he could have done a lot to help the saints out. Instead, he did slink away...maybe not as a rat, but as a man. He has not been held accountable for this damage that it did to the saints. He placed his comfort and his life before those of the saints he shepherded.

This also is the basis of my own query to all those formerly in leadership. How you end the race is the key thing! The silence is deafening!
Verne

[Arlene]

This thread needs to be rated PG13.

[Matt]

To my dear sister (or brother) in Christ (maybe) who may or may not  be in St. Louis. I see that you have managed to stir up bitterness, anger, wrath, and a lot of un-Godly sentiment on this thread. I'd say Satan accomplished his goal quite nicely through you. I'm sure he is patting you on the back right now. Verne blames this on the leading brothers, even though none of them made you post here. Now, ma'am, sir, whatever you want to be called, how did you expect their family to leave the assembly? Would you rather they had just disappeared and not leave a letter of any kind? No ma'am - that's ridiculous. In addition, you were far to dependent on the leading brothers if you can't get any healing without Jerry Robinson present. The only healing you will ever get will never come from a man - only from the Lord. Everything good comes from the Lord. The Robinsons will never be able to give you what they're looking for. Even if they had stayed in the assembly just to please you and it was  against how they felt they were being led - you'd still be unhappy. The Robinsons are just men (except for Ms. Robinson - she's a woman). They'll never replace what the Lord can give you. Turn to Him, hold on to Him, love Him, trust Him, and remember that only He will give you healing. The Robinsons cannot give you what you need, no human can.

As for your personal sentiments of the Robinsons, we are only hearing one side of the story. Remember, I've said it a lot on this board - there are 3 sides to every story: your side, my side, and the truth. Since you are anonymous, the Robinsons can't really present their side. My experience with Luke and Paul has been quite different and I know many people in San Diego really like L and P. They would be shocked to see you say these negative things about them. Who do you think is encouraging you to feel this envy, bitterness, hatred to the Robinsons? Do you think that's the Lord? Really listen to Him...is he saying: tell those Robinsons that you won't go to any wedding if they're going to be there. Ma'am, I'd urge you to stay away from here because as you said you can't take it anymore. This website will only encourage your bitterness, wrath, insecurity, etc. Already look at the replies on this thread. Repent and turn to Him. He loves you more than all the leading brothers in all the world combined. Amen? Amen.
- Matt

[editor]

Hello All!

"1 Sam 15:32  And Samuel said, Bring ye near to me  Agag  the king of Amalek. And  Agag  came to him gaily. And  Agag  said, Surely the bitterness of death is past.  33  And Samuel said, As thy sword has made women childless, so shall thy mother be childless above women. And Samuel hewed  Agag  in pieces before Jehovah in Gilgal. "

Think about this passage.  Not all bitterness and lack of forgiveness is bad, but much of it is.  Discernment is key here.

I learned something here in SLO, back when I was actively calling George, David and the leaders to repentance.

I viewed the leaders as being either Deceived, Ignorant, or Corrupt.  I still view them that way, especially the one's who held on to the very end.  There were some who really did stand up to George, Zach, David G., and others, who suffered for it, but I am talking about the leaders who were in place in December of 2002.

I observed their actions,  and drew conclusions about them based on what I knew and what I saw.  Due to the fact that I was enemy#1 at the time, and was by far the worst nightmare ever to visit George's house, I had very little contact with anyone except Danny Edwards.

Although I knew a lot of things that they didn't know, especially about George, there were some things that they knew that I didn't know.  Consequently, due to my knowledge, I assigned to them far more corruption than they deserved.  In fact, these men were far more deceived than I had realized, and when their eyes were opened, the largely behaved in an honorable way, especially Danny.

What I am trying to say is that even though Jerry left a note, and didn't elaborate on why, and didn't "stand" the way one would think a shepherd of twenty years should stand, we need to be careful assigning to him "rat" status.  There are undoubtedly other things to consider.

Notwithstanding,  I don't think anyone is going to argue that leaving a gathering where one was an elder or leader for over 20 years, and only leaving behind a note is rather extraordinary.  However, given the extraordinary nature of the Assembly, and the fact that the leader in question was an integral part of it, it really shouldn't be a surprise.

Yes, we all wish that these men would come forward with apologies.  I'm sure private apologies have been forthcoming, but there is something to be said for public ones, when appropriate.  However, do not suppose that leaders did not also suffer in the ASsembly.  They did.  


As for bitterness and hatred on the BB, we are all entitled to our opinions.

Now, we have named another person, Tony, and let it be known that he is spreading rumors in St. Louis.  I have never heard these rumors, and don't have any idea what he is saying about whom.  What I do know is that a person named Tony is telling lies....or do I?

Again, I'm not going to pay any attention to any of this.  Anonymous accusations are worthless.

As far as I'm concerned, everything said about Jerry and Tony, by a person who won't identify themselves, is false.  If our anonymous poster does know the truth, and is either afraid or unwilling to share it, then that is a bigger problem than an elder leaving behind a note.  This fear and secrecy are the very things that allowed this whole debacle in the first place.

My wish is that Brian Tucker would lock, or better yet delete this thread.  If we have something to say, let's have the courage to tell people who we are.j

Brent

[St. Louis sister]

To my dear sister (or brother) in Christ (maybe) who may or may not  be in St. Louis. I see that you have managed to stir up bitterness, anger, wrath, and a lot of un-Godly sentiment on this thread. I'd say Satan accomplished his goal quite nicely through you. I'm sure he is patting you on the back right now. Verne blames this on the leading brothers, even though none of them made you post here. Now, ma'am, sir, whatever you want to be called, how did you expect their family to leave the assembly? Would you rather they had just disappeared and not leave a letter of any kind? No ma'am - that's ridiculous. In addition, you were far to dependent on the leading brothers if you can't get any healing without Jerry Robinson present. The only healing you will ever get will never come from a man - only from the Lord. Everything good comes from the Lord. The Robinsons will never be able to give you what they're looking for. Even if they had stayed in the assembly just to please you and it was  against how they felt they were being led - you'd still be unhappy. The Robinsons are just men (except for Ms. Robinson - she's a woman). They'll never replace what the Lord can give you. Turn to Him, hold on to Him, love Him, trust Him, and remember that only He will give you healing. The Robinsons cannot give you what you need, no human can.

As for your personal sentiments of the Robinsons, we are only hearing one side of the story. Remember, I've said it a lot on this board - there are 3 sides to every story: your side, my side, and the truth. Since you are anonymous, the Robinsons can't really present their side. My experience with Luke and Paul has been quite different and I know many people in San Diego really like L and P. They would be shocked to see you say these negative things about them. Who do you think is encouraging you to feel this envy, bitterness, hatred to the Robinsons? Do you think that's the Lord? Really listen to Him...is he saying: tell those Robinsons that you won't go to any wedding if they're going to be there. Ma'am, I'd urge you to stay away from here because as you said you can't take it anymore. This website will only encourage your bitterness, wrath, insecurity, etc. Already look at the replies on this thread. Repent and turn to Him. He loves you more than all the leading brothers in all the world combined. Amen? Amen.
- Matt

Yes, you're right. I did not want to hurt the people I love on this board. I did not want them to be angry with me. Forgive me Mark, Daniel, Carolyn, Hannah, Luke, Paul, Tina,
I did not want to distress you. I did not expect this kind of reaction at all. Just know that I love you all very much and would never want to hurt you.

Jerry:
Forgive me brother. I acted in anger and selfishness. I do love your family and I know you have been good to the saints. I don't like what Tony Edwards is doing at all and I pray that God will open his eyes to his sin. Matt has a good point. I attached myself to much to you and your family and so when you left it was very difficult. I need to "attach" myself even more to the Lord.

Brent:
I agree with you. Please, Mr. Tucker, delete this thread if at all possible.

[Daniel Teater]

Thank you sister for that post, and let me tell you that I didn't mean to come off as some pompous windbag running his mouth, which is exactly how I sounded.  (However I still feel that you should reveal yourself.)

By the way to all who previously read my comments, I do wish to apologize for the antagonistic language especially in regards to Tony Edwards.  What I have stated before (about his slanderous comments) still stands, however I realize that trading insult for insult is the last thing God would want.  For that I apologize and ask you (Tony) for forgiveness and have taken down the offensive comments.

However with that note I again will reiterate that I have been truly shocked by different things you have written about the Robinsons.  I work with Paul and I can assure you that your comments have done nothing to build him up at all especially in such an important time as this.  Right now is when someone needs to come alongside him and edify and build him up not tear him down.

He told me about a time when he took you down to the hospital and afterward stopped in at McDonalds for you.  He remembers being willing to sacrifice his time and energy for you, but now all he feels is betrayed.

 To any and all who have received messages from Tony I simply ask that you take it with a grain of salt.  I have talked to numerous people here in St. Louis and it appears that he is hell-bent on some sort of crusade to decimate the reputations of others.  Remember it is by the mouth of two or three witnesses not by one (namely Tony Edwards).  If any of you who have received information from him please note that he rarely if ever posts on the main BB, because he knows the type of reaction he will get when everyone in St. Louis sees his bald-faced lies and twisted views.  Tony if you want to talk to me or to Luke or Paul or Jerry please let us know.  I will be happy to come over, and sort through these things, and if there is misunderstanding on my part then let me know and we can go from there.  Thanks

Oh by the way I agree delete this thread.

[St. Louis sister]

I cannot allow these kind of slanderous comments, Brent. I agree with some of the things you are trying to do on this bulletin board, but I know the families you are referring to in this PM better than you do. I can testify that your comments on these kids are entirely untrue. I very much regret starting this thread and posting on here. Please forgive me St. Louis saints for this, I was wrong. Here is the PM I received from Brent. Brent, I had to expose the slander for all to see in case you've told other people these things about the kids of the leadership in St. Louis.

Hello There

While I understand that you were telling the truth, and most other people understand the same thing, due to the nature of the BB, and the participation of several people, you simply can't anonymously accuse a Robinson, Teater, or Dodorico on the BB.  Nothing has "come out," on them, so you set a precendent with your post.

Personally, I agree with you, that an Elder should not flee at the first sign of real trouble.  However, what did you expect?  While your story has merit, it simply can't be told from an anonymous perspective.  May I suggest that you slowly re-enter the community here,  and warm up to the issue?  You will find that we are a very forgiving and tolerant bunch, with the exception of the STL leadership's kids.  You will get nothing but abuse from them,  unless you defend GG and his leadership.

I'm sorry i came out against your post, but it was a matter of principle.  The vast majority of anonymous posts on this board have been from people who wanted to attack me, or defend GG, or both.  We didn't allow them to do it anonymously, and stated reasons of principle.  I couldn't compromise in this case.

Brent

[editor]

I cannot allow these kind of slanderous comments, Brent. I agree with some of the things you are trying to do on this bulletin board, but I know the families you are referring to in this PM better than you do. I can testify that your comments on these kids are entirely untrue. I very much regret starting this thread and posting on here. Please forgive me St. Louis saints for this, I was wrong. Here is the PM I received from Brent. Brent, I had to expose the slander for all to see in case you've told other people these things about the kids of the leadership in St. Louis.

Hello There

While I understand that you were telling the truth, and most other people understand the same thing, due to the nature of the BB, and the participation of several people, you simply can't anonymously accuse a Robinson, Teater, or Dodorico on the BB.  Nothing has "come out," on them, so you set a precendent with your post.

Personally, I agree with you, that an Elder should not flee at the first sign of real trouble.  However, what did you expect?  While your story has merit, it simply can't be told from an anonymous perspective.  May I suggest that you slowly re-enter the community here,  and warm up to the issue?  You will find that we are a very forgiving and tolerant bunch, with the exception of the STL leadership's kids.  You will get nothing but abuse from them,  unless you defend GG and his leadership.

I'm sorry i came out against your post, but it was a matter of principle.  The vast majority of anonymous posts on this board have been from people who wanted to attack me, or defend GG, or both.  We didn't allow them to do it anonymously, and stated reasons of principle.  I couldn't compromise in this case.

Brent

Thanks.  My name is Brent Tr0ckman.  What's yours?
Another principle that I have has to do with trust.  Thanks for sharing a PM that I wrote to you with everyone on the board.  I'm sure everyone will notice this, and appreciate it very much.

Would you like to see any of the PM's I get from others?  Shall I share them with everyone, like you did mine?

I can't wait to see what happens next.

Brent--real name--real person.  

PS--I learned something from you, whoever you are, what I don't understand is if you know these families so well, and are so supportive of them, what did you start this thread for?  I didn't start it, verne didn't start it, you started it.  And then, when someone tries to reach you, privately, you respond in public?  The St. Louis Assemlby must have been a great training ground indeed.

[Andrea Denner]

STL Sister,
I don't mean to sound harsh, but I'm having a hard time believing that you are who you say you are.  You claim to regret having started this thread, but at key times have pulled it back up to the front with rather ire-stirring comments and information.
What gives??

Andrea