Pierced Ears

[Uh Oh]

Heide -

What on earth were you thinking buying a new vehicle!!!

That money you spent could have bought a lot of new auto parts or pornography for David Geftakys.  Tim Geftakys really could have used that money for a family vacation!

Shame on you for being so self centered!

[Arthur]

I showed up at a Bible Study with it, parked it on the street, walked in casually. I never made it inside because a LB stepped in front of me and blocked the entrance. "What is that you are driving?", I was asked. "A ford", was my response. "What's wrong with the suburban?", I was asked by the LB "I drive one, isn't it good enough for you?" He said in a real snotty tone. I said"It would be good enough for me if I hadn't just sunk $4,000. in repairs into it and it is still broken.." The next line of questioning, angered me. "Where did you get the money to pay for it?"

Oh my!  "Must...control...fist of death."  I am dumbfounded.  What in the world possessed the l.b. meet you at the door to grill you on your truck?

Makes no sense.

[Margaret]

In the 70's George did this on two separate occasions to two different brothers in Fullerton, when they drove up in cars he didn't approve of because they were too expensive.  And he told the workers about it as an example of what is not acceptable and how to deal with it.  The lesson that  came home to me was those cars represented financial resources that should have been given to the Lord's treasury instead.  In both cases, the brothers got rid of the nice cars and replaced them with old ones.

[amycahill]

The entire Bible is not relevant? What part is? What part do I discard?

The entire Bible IS relevant, and the Word of God.  However, it must be carefully and reasonably interpreted.  You don't, for example, interpret a poetry book the same way you interpret a history book.  I think that's what is being said here.  George Geftakys did pretty much whatever he wanted with it and FORCED (coerced, manipulated) other people to do the same.  He didn't allow people to think for themselves.  That's what's so evil about the system.

[amycahill]

What if I think putting piercings throughout my body is something the Lord would not approve of? What if I think that having a TV in my home will defile my family? What if I don't like the idea of some guy sucking on my 16 year old daughter's face or perhaps worse.

Moral values and standards are not copyright. The assembly did not invent them. Others may hold to those convictions. Breaking from assembly thought is not outward defiance of their decree. It is something inside.

If these are your moral standards, you are, of course, entitled to live them.  The beauty of it is that this is YOUR choice.  Your free, personal choice.  What was bad about the Assembly is that they MADE people do whatever they said through fear and intimidation, rather than letting people check for themselves whether or not the Assembly's "rules" were true or God's will.

[amycahill]

I read your story, Heide -- glad to see you here.

You must have been considered quite an "uppity" sister.  A horse ranch and a truck!  Wow!  And you thought for yourself!  Quite dangerous!

You should have given all that money to The Work, you know!  *snort*

God bless,
Amy

[Heide]

Hi Amy,

Considering how the Mission Training Teams were virtually a dating service. It amazes me that I was never asked to go on one!!!

Heide

P.S. Yes I wore gold hoops, the bigger the better. I just waited for someone to say something.... I do remember an incident with some African brother and his wife and we were asked to not wear gold hoops to the fellowship. Of course we were also asked not to wear shorts or sleeveless tops too. Since I didn't have anything to wear, I didn't go. Apparently the  sister from Africa did wear gold hoops, big ones! I found out afterwards that in their culture short pants are a sign of poverty. I guess George wanted us to look well off....

[Heide]

Oh sure Arthur,

You must not have been around when I bought the ranch and asked all you brothers to help me move! It was one of the sorriest days of my life and I couldn't wait for all of you to leave. The ridicule that I got for owning so much stuff. "How could I afford to have so many nice things?" Being grilled for why I had bought so much land and what did I intend to do with it. Treating me like I had no brain. It was at that moment that I determined if a Proverbs 31 woman ever did walk into the midst of the assembly she would NEVER be able to do ANY of those things listed, like buy a field.....

Heide

Arthur, c'mon, who owned a suburban and was an LB and WHO yelled at me when Jeff L repented at the meeting. You can figure this one out....

[Arthur]

Oh sure Arthur,

You must not have been around when I bought the ranch and asked all you brothers to help me move!

You bought the ranch...and yet you are still here with us among the living?  

No, I'm sooo sorry I was not around to help with that.  I have a few moving stories myself.  No pun intended.
Seems like I was always helping people move.  David's move was the worst.  And I did help in the Francis move, more on that below.

It was one of the sorriest days of my life and I couldn't wait for all of you to leave. The ridicule that I got for owning so much stuff. "How could I afford to have so many nice things?"

Were the leaders there too?  I'm having a hard time picturing that being the case since you weren't a worker or anything they'd consider important enough to help.  If not, I wonder who asked you that.
I'm suprised you didn't tell those young whipper-snappers to go take a hike, jump in a creak and/or go fly a kite!

Though, I do remember thinking similar thoughts about all the stuff that Francis had--filled a large-sized Uhaul.  I didn't know how any one person could accumulate so much stuff.  Everything that I had fit in my car.  Well, that was before I graduated from college  Just giving you the young brother who was never anything more than a peon perspective. ^^

Being grilled for why I had bought so much land and what did I intend to do with it. Treating me like I had no brain. It was at that moment that I determined if a Proverbs 31 woman ever did walk into the midst of the assembly she would NEVER be able to do ANY of those things listed, like buy a field.....

Hahaha!  Good point!

Arthur, c'mon, who owned a suburban and was an LB and WHO yelled at me when Jeff L repented at the meeting. You can figure this one out....

Ah yeah, that's who I thought.   Sheesh.  Must...control...fist of death again.

[amycahill]

You probably weren't ever asked on the Mission Training Teams because you didn't fit the "mission profile."  I didn't either, but for different reasons.

God had my husband waiting for me when I came home to Colorado.  I am eternally grateful for that!!!

[jackhutchinson]

I remember helping Heide move that day.  Her move was definitely not sanctioned by the leadership.  None of the leaders were there, and I don't remember any enthusiastic pleas for help at the prayer meeting, etc.  I remember only the Foys and the Tr0ckmans helping Heide move, along with a couple of singles and myself (the Foys and the Tr0ckmans left the assembly a few months later).

Shortly after Heide moved, she stopped coming to the meetings.  I remember thinking how terrible I thought it was that she stopped coming to the meetings after we had done so much to help her.  I was trying to earn her loyalty to the group by doing nice things for her.  Has anyone else thought this way?

I also remember giving the Cesaretti's a hard time about the amount of things they had when they moved.  We were just a wonderful bunch, weren't we?

Jack

[vernecarty]

You really ought to publish the name of this imbecile so the apporpriate amount of scorn can be duly heaped upon him. We helped  to create despicable cretins such as this...
Verne

You want names, Verne?    I can give you names. Because the same kind of 'problems' existed here, all the way across the continent and way up north.
And they say that the assemblies were autonomous...
Looks like the same leader, over all the assemblies (generally speaking, of course).

Marcia

P.S.  Sorry Will, we're off topic again. Maybe we should just rename this thread: Pierced Ears, and Cars, and...
 

Hi Marcia:
Do you realise that at the time George was busily building his empire there were quite a number of bretheren who knew exactly what kind of man he was? These bretheren were unfaithful and did many of us a terrible dis-service by their silence. George's un-repentant dicsiples should all be identified and all God's people everywhere duly warned about these ravenous wolves...
Verne

In the 70's George did this on two separate occasions to two different brothers in Fullerton, when they drove up in cars he didn't approve of because they were too expensive.  And he told the workers about it as an example of what is not acceptable and how to deal with it.  The lesson that  came home to me was those cars represented financial resources that should have been given to the Lord's treasury instead.  In both cases, the brothers got rid of the nice cars and replaced them with old ones.

How could we possibly have descended to this...?!!!! Did  NO ONE interject BROTHER THAT IS NOT YOUR BUSINESS??!!
No wonder he fleeced us...

Ah yeah, that's who I thought.   Sheesh.  Must...control...fist of death again.

Awww...! Go ahead and unleash it...
Verne

[Eulaha L. Long]

I remember helping Heide move that day too! I remember being jealous of you, Heide, because you lived on your own and you were miles away from the "saints"and the Assembly influence.  I remember you asking me to stay at the ranch while you and the others went back to pick up stuff from Paso.  I remember unpacking your china.  I had a lot of time to think while up there.  I really wanted to get out of that goofey group, but felt to obligated to stay.  Anyways, I never thought you had too much stuff!  I admired you for having such nice pieces of furniture...

[M2]

You want names, Verne?    I can give you names. Because the same kind of 'problems' existed here, all the way across the continent and way up north.
And they say that the assemblies were autonomous...
Looks like the same leader, over all the assemblies (generally speaking, of course).

Marcia

You can put my name on the list, after Jack's . I do not intend to name names unless absolutely necessary.  I personally was not involved in 'car' counselling, but I was involved in the 'system', so I declare that I am guilty too.

The point I was attempting to make is that the same problems existed in most all the assemblies, which indicates the influence of one leader - Guess Who??
This is very indicative of a cult-like mentality.

Marcia

[Heide]

Thanks Eulaha,

You are still welcome at the ranch! Too bad you didn't split then instead of having to deal with TG....

Heide