Where is Mark Miller??????

[summer007]

where is Mark Miller GG's Elder ???How does he get away with all of this ? Yes, I've seen the posts that he's stepped down..and that his wife had the sence to leave. Someone said,Oh Hes eating dirt he feels so Bad..well where is he why does'nt he respond...Where is this DIRT eating taking place?? I'd like to see it!!!!!

[matthew r. sciaini]

Summer007:

He is in Fullerton.  I can give you his address and phone number if you want to PM me.

Matt Sciaini

[summer007]

Thanks Matt.

[matthew r. sciaini]

Summer:

Regarding Mark Miller:

He himself is devastated and seems not to want to talk about a lot of this stuff right now.  If you read Dave Sable's article on the home page entitled "Who's your daddy"  it might bring some things regarding Mark Miller and his action (or lack of it) into perspective.  His father was absent from the time Mark was six years old and saw GG as the father he wish he had growing up.  Can you imagine the disillusionment that he must have gone through (and is still going through, maybe) when he saw that GG would not even come to the local leadership when they attempted to investigate him according to Scripture for his sin???

By the way, he also promised, along with the other elders (in the writing of the excommunication letter) not to abandon the little flock, but to be around for them.  I think that that was ill-advised on his part even if well-meaning.  He is not going regularly to the meetings and, according to his wife, it is only a matter of time before this (fullerton) shuts down.

Matt Sciaini

[summer007]

Thank-You Matt.

[mithrandir]

I don't think Mark Miller is devastated because of George's lack of repentance.  I think Mark and the other former "leading brethren" knew for a long time what kind of wretched son of the devil they were serving.  I think what has devastated Mark and the rest is the fact that things were brought into the light, and that their little empire has come crashing down.  I have very little sympathy for him.  That might change if he were to come to me and say, "You know, Clarence, in my treatment of you and others as a so-called shepherd, I really screwed up.  I'm sorry."  He hasn't said that yet, nor have the others.

On the other hand, I have been calling people up and saying, "You know, as a doorkeeper in the assembly, I was harsh with you.  I lorded myself over you.  I screwed up.  I'm sorry."  It has been hard to say, but not as hard as living with unconfessed sin.  If I can do it, anyone else should be able to!

Clarence Thompson

[editor]

I don't think Mark Miller is devastated because of George's lack of repentance.  I think Mark and the other former "leading brethren" knew for a long time what kind of wretched son of the devil they were serving.  I think what has devastated Mark and the rest is the fact that things were brought into the light, and that their little empire has come crashing down.  I have very little sympathy for him.  That might change if he were to come to me and say, "You know, Clarence, in my treatment of you and others as a so-called shepherd, I really screwed up.  I'm sorry."  He hasn't said that yet, nor have the others.

On the other hand, I have been calling people up and saying, "You know, as a doorkeeper in the assembly, I was harsh with you.  I lorded myself over you.  I screwed up.  I'm sorry."  It has been hard to say, but not as hard as living with unconfessed sin.  If I can do it, anyone else should be able to!

Clarence Thompson

Right on Clarence!  We aren't asking them to do anything we haven't already done.  I would be happy if they said a tenth of what I have said.   Just a few sincere paragraphs would encourage me.

But to say nothing at all, after everything that has happened?  

They used to travel across the country and preach George's "Heavenly Vision."  They excommunicated people, slandered people, controlled people and were basically jerks.....FROR DECADES!

One paragraph per decade......that would be nice.   "I am sorry,  I led you astray and wasn't a good shepherd,"  That would floor me!

Again, a few have done this, but not all.  

Worse than remaining silent are those who claim that they never followed George, or that God will lead them NOW, because they are reading the Bible and praying.  

There is none so blind as he who will not see.

Brent

[summer007]

Clarence, Believe me I too find it hard to believe that was Marks first run in with GG....or first disagreement..I think the major problem with Leaders coming forward is the verse in I Cor 6 "dare anyone to go before the world with a matter and not before the Saints', etc...it is so ingrained the problem is were talking about a Cult issue/Abberant christian Groups the  world could care-less ..All men seek their own and not the things of Christ...Their might be a research group watching ...but if they have nothing to hide whats the problem??? We can be forgiven ..yet still bare the consequences of our behavior...I understand if someone is overcome with Grief...I feel for them ..but if you've preached to this group for 30+ years and have nothing to say it makes you wonder...If GG was his Father figure I understand too not wanting to admit  whats happened ..No one wanted to believe it...Its hard to Believe..Harder still to break through the Denial...but in the End I think God will get Glory ..I'm not sure how but he always  Wins....

[vernecarty]

But to say nothing at all, after everything that has happened?  

Brent

The reason for the protracted silence is quite simple -  PRIDE...
It is quite remarkable that some of these former leaders do not see that the true consummation of the grace of forgiveness does not occur without ultimate confession. In this they continue to injure the flock entrusted to their care. I do not argue that forgiveness should be held in abeyance until confession is forthcoming...I do argue that no one ultimately experiences God's forgiveness apart from confession. In this, the former leadership continue to deny themselves and others a vital blessing...
Thank you again Ray D. I was enlarged and uplifted by your display of humility...
May God Almighty restore the years...

As one person said, most of the people who left the assembly in Champaign can be traced to him. Without sharing the gory details, let it suffice to say that when everything broke loose last December/January it was this LB's lack of integrity that was the assembly's undoing in Champaign. Frankly, I can do nothing but thank him for placing that seed of doubt in my mind about the assembly and its idea of spiritual leadership way back in 1990. That seed was watered and made to flourish by this LB's consistent attention. May God have mercy on him.
God is so faithful.
Pat Mathews

His recognition precipitated my own departure. There has never been a more solemn wail of ICHABOD than the rise of this wolf in sheep's clothing. You are being alltogether too gracious...the light of God's Word clearly illuminates and unmasks false brethren such as these...should we not...?
Verne

[summer007]

Interesting that you mentioned Pride..How about Reputation and pride...Sunday the "Sermon' was on Nicodemus and other Pharisees. Difference with Nicodemus is he went to Jesus by night and Jesus recieved him...Of course he was risking his reputation, and all the praises of men ..But look what he got in return...God himself...He was also there with Joseph collecting the body of our Lord...and preparing it..hum...The theme was also on doing our works in secret...and God rewarding us Openly!!!! Just in case mark ever reads here remember the verse II cor 5:17..new man in Christ ...In Eternity all that will matter is His Love that covers a multitude of Sins we arnt going to be thinking of the Assm and all its shotcomings!!!!

[editor]

In Eternity all that will matter is His Love that covers a multitude of Sins we arnt going to be thinking of the Assm and all its shotcomings!!!!

Absolutely!  What a great reminder of what is really important.  We won't be the least bit worried about any of this petty nonsense then.  Sadly, in our current state, it is things like this which cause us the most grief.  But it will be different someday.

Brent

[Steaners]

It is very sad reading all these comments from everyone regarding my dad.  I think it is time that everyone really realizes how George had us all screwed over.  My dad looked up to George as his dad and believe me, my dad did not know what George was doing behind the "scenes".  My dad does realize he has made many mistakes, but we cant just keep going on in life with a guilty conscience.  God has forgiven him and all of us for all of our rude and obsurd comments, as well as the many mistakes we have made in life.  I just wish we would all come together and forgive and forget.  My dad gave SOOOOOOOOOOO much to the assembly and didnt realize how much things effected those around him, until now - especially his relationship with his family!   There are many things now that I see would have been different in our family if it werent for the influence of the assembly and George.  It breaks my heart to see and hear what people have to say about him.  I know people will always talk bad, but it would be so great if we could join together and just love one another for who they are and not all the mistakes we think other make or have made.  By the way, my family is doing very well since the "break-up".  Thanks for asking.  My parents still live in Fullerton and attend an EV Free.  They love it and are finding new friends they can get to know.  I recently got married and live with my husband in Rancho Santa Margarita.  My brother is doing well and lives in Fullerton as well.  I hope this might explain a bit about how I feel and what is going on currently. 

Christina Elmore (a.k.a. Miller)

[Sondra Jamison]

It is very sad reading all these comments from everyone regarding my dad.  I think it is time that everyone really realizes how George had us all screwed over.  My dad looked up to George as his dad and believe me, my dad did not know what George was doing behind the "scenes".  My dad does realize he has made many mistakes, but we cant just keep going on in life with a guilty conscience.  God has forgiven him and all of us for all of our rude and obsurd comments, as well as the many mistakes we have made in life.  I just wish we would all come together and forgive and forget.  My dad gave SOOOOOOOOOOO much to the assembly and didnt realize how much things effected those around him, until now - especially his relationship with his family!   There are many things now that I see would have been different in our family if it werent for the influence of the assembly and George.  It breaks my heart to see and hear what people have to say about him.  I know people will always talk bad, but it would be so great if we could join together and just love one another for who they are and not all the mistakes we think other make or have made.  By the way, my family is doing very well since the "break-up".  Thanks for asking.  My parents still live in Fullerton and attend an EV Free.  They love it and are finding new friends they can get to know.  I recently got married and live with my husband in Rancho Santa Margarita.  My brother is doing well and lives in Fullerton as well.  I hope this might explain a bit about how I feel and what is going on currently. 

Christina Elmore (a.k.a. Miller)

Hi Christina,

Please follow the link to read my response to your post.  I have been suspended from this board for, IMO, disagreeing too strongly with the powers that be regarding the very issue you address here.  Consequently, I only share a link and give the readers the choice of reading my sincere and unapologetic views on ongoing maintenance of bitterness and unforgiveness or not to read.  My post is too long for the parameters of this board anyway and that makes it complicated to post a long post.


http://www.soaringwiththeeagles.com/yabbse/index.php?board=4;action=display;threadid=359;start=0#msg1981

Lord bless you, Christina.

Sondra Jamison

[Steaners]

Hi Sondra,

Thank you SO much for your openness regarding my comments.  I also did get your personal message.

You are right on!  Thank you so much!

O...and how can you be suspended on a BB when you are just sharing your thoughts?  Seems a little assembly-like to me 

Thanks again and I hope people did get on with their lives and forgive and forget like we all really want to do deep down ..

Christina

[Joe Sperling]

I'm just curious--if Sondra is suspended from the board( as she states), how is she posting?
Also, Steaners, thanks for the post, but the last post regarding your dad appeared to have
been made in January of 2004--so no one has mentioned your dad for more than a year and a half--
I don't know whether you noticed the date or not of the last post before yours.

Thanks, Joe

P.S. add on----I don't mean to take away from what you are saying regarding your dad and your
family Steaners. I just mention the date, because some have come to the BB and clicked on a thread
and think that it is a recent statement and possibly join a conversation that took place a year ago without realizing it, that's all.

all the best, Joe