What happens at death?

[M2]

What happens at death?

We know that the body dies.  What happens to the soul and the spirit?

Marcia

[M2]

What happens at death?

We know that the body dies.  What happens to the soul and the spirit?

Marcia

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.  2 Cor 5:8

Verne

p.s. the unsaved are another matter...the story of Lazarus and the rich man may be probative ( Luke 16:19-31).

Someone commented that the soul also dies and is only resurrected at the resurrection, hence my question.

From 2Cor 5:8 would it be that our spirit is present with the Lord at the time of death?

Marcia

[vernecarty]

What happens at death?

We know that the body dies.  What happens to the soul and the spirit?

Marcia

We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.  2 Cor 5:8

Verne

p.s. the unsaved are another matter...the story of Lazarus and the rich man may be probative ( Luke 16:19-31).

Someone commented that the soul also dies and is only resurrected at the resurrection, hence my question.

From 2Cor 5:8 would it be that our spirit is present with the Lord at the time of death?

Marcia

It is difficult to speak of death in the usual sense when referring to believers. I do not know of any specific Scriptural reference to resurrection of the soul.
The intermediate state between separation from the body and bodily resurrection is referred to as "sleep".
There is no basis for supposing the soul, the center of conscience and awareness does not remain viable even with the destruction or "death", of the body.
Verne
p.s. we know that the soul leaves the body at the time of death (Gen. 35:18) but its destination is a matter of mostly inference from other things stated in Scripture.

[Oscar]

Marcia,

In my second semester of Essential Christian Doctrine the professor devoted part of one lecture to "The Eternal State"

He pointed out the verses about "absent from the body, present with the Lord" and "today you will be with me in paradise" and a couple of others.  These verses seem to speak of a conscious spiritual existence of some kind after death.

He also pointed out the verses that could possible imply the "soul sleep" teaching held my some people.

His conclusions were as follows:

1. The major eschatological teaching of the scriptures concerns cosmic eschatology. It is concerned with Christ, Satan, the world and the universe.  Personal eschatology is a very minor topic.
2. Because of #1, there is a whole lot we just don't know about the intermediate state, ie, the time between death and the resurrection.
3. This has left the intermediate state as "a rich and fertile field for unbiblical speculation".

So, his advice was to always "chasten your imagination to the Bible."  He advised us against letting the spirit of the age "push" us theologically...that we should stick to what is actually revealed, and not commit ourselves to ideas that we cannot clearly support with scripture.

I think he was right.  I believe that the intermediate state is conscious enjoyment of the Lord.  But, I don't think that the soul sleepers are dangerous heretics.  Remember, they only disagree about when, not what.

Blessings,

Thomas Maddux

[al Hartman]

In my second semester of Essential Christian Doctrine the professor devoted part of one lecture to "The Eternal State"

   ...his advice was to always "chasten your imagination to the Bible."  He advised us against letting the spirit of the age "push" us theologically...that we should stick to what is actually revealed, and not commit ourselves to ideas that we cannot clearly support with scripture.

I think he was right...

Blessings,

Thomas Maddux

Sound counsel regarding any topic.  Even pertaining to matters not directly addressed in scripture, it behooves us to keep in mind that our commitment to Christ takes precedence over all other considerations.  As for the spiritual, we must resist the urge to exceed the knowledge of what information our Lord has given us, and pray for clarity of mind toward what we have.  Thanks Tom.

In Christ,
al

[moonflower2]

 But, I don't think that the soul sleepers are dangerous heretics.  

Thomas Maddux

Well, I hope not.

1) What does the word "sleep" mean in ICor15:51 - "We shall not all sleep"?

Could it mean "rest" as in Rev6:11 - "and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer until both the number.... was completed."

It seems as if those Christians who were beheaded, although "resting", were in the presence of God.
 
And if the rich man & Lazarus are considered, Lazarus was in Abe's bosom and Lazarus already in some kind of torment.

2) Isn't there a difference in the afterlife between the OT and the NT?

David talks about his soul not being left in Sheol. Ps16:1, for example.

Looks like the "spirit" is the first to go, eh? Ecclesiates12:7 "and the spirit will return unto God who gave it."

[vernecarty]

 But, I don't think that the soul sleepers are dangerous heretics.  

Thomas Maddux

Well, I hope not.

1) What does the word "sleep" mean in ICor15:51 - "We shall not all sleep"?

I don't know if Tom will elaborate  but with the possible exception of Matthew 28:13 and Luke 22:45, every place the NT uses this word seems to be a reference to the pre-resurrection state of the departed believer. The word used for normal slumber is generally a different one.

Could it mean "rest" as in Rev6:11 - "and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer until both the number.... was completed."

Different word here.

Verne

[moonflower2]

 But, I don't think that the soul sleepers are dangerous heretics.  

Thomas Maddux

Well, I hope not.

1) What does the word "sleep" mean in ICor15:51 - "We shall not all sleep"?

I don't know if Tom will elaborate  but with the possible exception of Matthew 28:13 and Luke 22:45, every place the NT uses this word seems to be a reference to the pre-resurrection state of the departed believer. The word used for normal slumber is generally a different one.

Could it mean "rest" as in Rev6:11 - "and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer until both the number.... was completed."

Different word here.

Verne

I see. Thank you!