Trouble Brewing at Focus on the Family

[vernecarty]

You make some valid distinctions Al. I have a very good friend whom I know has been doing his best to not divulge it but whom I suspect to be.
We have never discussed it and he knows I am a Christian, albeit not a "religious- right- winger".
I am going to have to share the gospel and I pray for an opporunity for I have never actually put the question to him regarding what he thinks of Jesus Christ. It is my duty to do so at some point I believe.
Militant gay activism does indeed have a spiritual component and this is what so many dull folk refuse to recognize. If it were indeed only a matter of what people did as some contend, "in the privacy of their homes", there would hardly be an issue. That is the way it was for decades, in fact most of human history.
The current activism reminds me of the presumption of the men of Sodom. It is the same spirit.
I suggest it will have to ultimately face the same sanction. I want to be nowhere near the city.
Verne

p.s. it is really startling the way some of these folk are taking God's name in vain, claiming to be "people of faith." There was a reason for remaining in the closet. Caution has now apparently been tossed to the wind.
I despise people who take God's name in vain.
How often have you seen someone engage in the most vicious and repugnant conduct and then sign off with "Lord Bless"? It is a certain mark of unholy influences.
It is the primary reason I despise Geftakys; not just because he failed, we all do, it is the way he did it...the man bears the mark of Iscariot...

[night owl]

Sorry Al, didn't mean to be glib - 

[al Hartman]

Sorry Al, didn't mean to be glib - 

Night Owl,

You weren't and you aren't-- I didn't have your post in mind.  "Hate the sin but love the sinner" is a valid concept, based upon the example of the triune Godhead.  But some toss off such remarks, smoothly parroting what they have heard but do not understand.  You give no impression of being one of them.

Please accept my apology for implying otherwise.

In Christ,
al

[al Hartman]

So...what about the Christians who divorce and remarry?  The Christians who have sex b4 marriage?  The

Christians who lie, lust in their hearts, beat their wives, etc...why doesn't James Dobson make a big to-do

about these folks?  No, he's too busy telling his followers to stop allowing their kids to watch Sponge Bob and

Barney...not to mention the Telletubies!

Eulaha, I'm guessing from your remarks that you have read little or none of Dobson's writings and that your comments are based upon what you have heard from others who disagree with him.  I suggest you visit a Christian bookstore or look at Focus On the Family's website and just review some of his titles.  He has written about all the subjects you mention.

It is not Dobson who has singled homosexuals out from among other sinners, but those among the homosexual population who rabidly want to attack him to shut him up.

  Back up to Square Pants for a minute.  Is Dobson upset because

maybe, oh maybe the little kids will learn to tolerate people who are not like them?  That maybe if they have

homosexual feelings that it doesn't mean that they are perverted? Wow, what a crime! Such a sin!  If I ever

have children, I will teach them about tolerance-about accepting others just as they are, and not to try

and "change them" into someone we would like them to be.

Good for you (no kidding)!  Dr. Dobson is all for tolerance-- the major division he recognizes is between the lost and the saved.  He is not afraid that children will be friendly toward homosexuals, but is trying to protect children from being preyed upon by people who have no scruples, no consience, regardless of their sexual orientation.  It just so happens that there is a huge contingent of homosexual people who do have a distintly anti-Christ agenda, and are working 24/7/365 to legitimize their "right" to push it onto everybody else.  My saying this is not gay-bashing, as it does not involve all homosexuals, but it is fact.

  I have plenty of gay friends.  They know that I

am Christian.  That's where I leave it.  God will change their hearts when HE is good and ready to!

What makes you think He isn't ready to do so right now?  I only hope you never have to be confronted by those friends after it's too late, and hear them ask you, "Why didn't you tell me?"

  Maybe if Mr. Dobson stopped calling out the homosexual population, there would be no need for them to collectively go to Focus on the Family!

Can you show us a quote or a link that will demonstrate how Dr. Dobson has "called out" homosexuals?  The fact is that a very powerful, very determined faction of the homosexual community is calling out Dr. Dobson and his organization with the intent to discredit them and, by association, to discredit the gospel of Jesus Christ.  When those battle lines are drawn, where will you stand?

In Christ,
al

[outdeep]

So...what about the Christians who divorce and remarry?  The Christians who have sex b4 marriage?  The

Christians who lie, lust in their hearts, beat their wives, etc...why doesn't James Dobson make a big to-do

about these folks?  No, he's too busy telling his followers to stop allowing their kids to watch Sponge Bob and

Barney...not to mention the Telletubies!  Back up to Square Pants for a minute.  Is Dobson upset because

maybe, oh maybe the little kids will learn to tolerate people who are not like them?  That maybe if they have

homosexual feelings that it doesn't mean that they are perverted? Wow, what a crime! Such a sin!  If I ever

have children, I will teach them about tolerance-about accepting others just as they are, and not to try

and "change them" into someone we would like them to be.  I have plenty of gay friends.  They know that I

am Christian.  That's where I leave it.  God will change their hearts when HE is good and ready to!  Maybe if

Mr. Dobson stopped calling out the homosexual population, there would be no need for them to collectively go

to Focus on the Family!

Dr. Dobson does speak out against these other sins.  The difference is that those who lust, beat their wives, divorse, etc. don't form organziations in order to normalize their behavior in churches, on television, with children and in sex education material.  Wife beaters don't try and reprogram folks to think that if we don't buy into their lifestyle we are intolerant, bigoted wife-beater-aphobes.  Homosexuals do.

No one is saying to be mean to or ignore your gay friends.  On the other hand, I don't think that folks should silently sit by while homosexual groups try and remold society into their image.

[vernecarty]

The legacy of Dr. James Dobson as an advocate for the family is well established.
He has been a very faithful steward in my opinion.
His manner of life, unlike so many vain talkers, attests powerfully to the things he espouses.
It is truly sobering to me, that any Christian would take the part of homosexual activists agaisnt a man like this. They have done their job of propagandizing well apparently.
On prinicple alone, every Christian should be standing shoulder to shoulder with him.
It is the objective of gay activism to divide the Christian community on this issue - divide and conquer.
They would like to have folk believe that James Dobson is the problem.
Christians cannot possibly be that stupid to fall for a ploy like this, can they?
The issue is what God's Word teaches about homosexuality, pure and simple.
They cannot, even with the help of the NIV, make any  convincing arguments that would provide a Biblical basis for toleration of this kind of behaviour, so their next best strategy is to destroy the messenger. It is the ultimate aim of these folk to place practicing homosexuals in the pulpit, and have them licensed to have day-care centers. It is also their aim to get legislative sanction to sue anyone who so much as objects to this being done. This is already the case in some places in Europe.
Verne

[Recovering Saint]

I for one have a lot of respect for Dr. Dobson and the Focus on the Family organization.

I smell a rat. The left agenda is at work here to silence the key voice in America for values that is it plain and simple.

I mentioned a speaker I heard recently. He echoes the same thoughts in the Quote for the day.

The quote for today is interesting to me and prompted me to invite others to consider this. We are being slowly but surely put under house arrest and will eventually not be allowed to say anything about the society around us.

Are Christians allowed to be involved in political debates or discussions on morals in the general public?

Seems we always get the backhanded slant in the media. They don't want us involved in decisions that affect the family because that is where the future generation lies. The general society wants to brainwash our next genreration so they can PUSH THEIR POLITICALLY CORRECT assertions on our unsuspecting youth.

http://www.str.org/cgi-bin/daily_commentary.pl

NOTE The contents change at this link change daily so if you don't visit this site today you can look for this article on his site at a later day.

Look for the following article.

The Privatization of Faith

QUOTE

Gregory Koukl

Why are some people worried about religious people getting involved in politics? What does the First Amendment really say about the right to act politically on religious grounds? Greg calls for Christians not to be frightened but to stand firm in the areas of morality and values.

UNQUOTE

.............................

The following is the last part of a long article on Promise Keepers and Christians involved in moral decisions and political choices.

CONTINUED QUOTE FROM END OF THE MESSAGE FOLLOWS.

It seems to me that if someone was really concerned about this kind of distinction between religion and the operations of the state, they should at least let religion freely operate in the areas that it is now allegedly limited to -- the domain of morality and values. We have a religious group that speaks to some of these issues of morality and values, and all of a sudden they are off limits again. "Don't do that." Why not? "Those are political issues." Since when? "Since someone decided. They are political issues and you have no right speaking to them. Shut up. Get back in your closet."

I don't know what else we can do, as religious people. Maybe we're just meant to stay in our closet and pray and never bring up any issues. It's a clever co-option here. Something you should be alert to.

I'm not whining, not crying. I think it's rather interesting. But it points up the fact that we are not in strange territory here. We are exactly where we ought to be. They are trying to push us out of that territory, even the little territory people say is left to us. Don't go. Don't run. Don't fret, Stay where you are. Do the job. Don't be afraid.

END OF QUOTE

Hugh

[summer007]

Eulaha, You seem to have a real passionate defence of the gay community and a real compassion for them. I hav'ent seen the cartoons you refer too so I cannot comment on the controversy. Christians do come across as Goody-Two shoes alot of the time. I think they may be afraid of the Gay agenda because alot of them have lived in Holy Matrimony for so long, and the Gays idea of Faithful is about 7 to 10 affairs a year if in a monogamous relationship vs.single they have about 70 to 100 casual partners per year. This is frightening to the vast majority of heterosexuals. Read the Medical Article from Moonflowers link. The average lifespan for Gays is 44 they invite so many diseses into the're systems. So many people treat them like modern day lepers. Its sad, but true I'd say most would not want a Gay Family joining them, re: sitting next to them for a Sunday service, nor would they want their children to play at their houses, again sad, but true. God's Goodness leads us all to repentance, we all have things to work on.  Summer.

[vernecarty]

I for one have a lot of respect for Dr. Dobson and the Focus on the Family organization.

. Don't go. Don't run. Don't fret, Stay where you are. Do the job. Don't be afraid.

END OF QUOTE

Hugh

A few years ago the Bulls were in a play-off game against the Pistons in Detroit and they really ganged up on Michael Jordan. The pistons were at the time a very physical and intimidating team with Rodman thinking that every rebound belonged to him by rights. Well, they really bullied the bulls.
The next game in Chicago was amazing. The bulls came out and gave them a taste of their own medicine. It was one of the most physical NBA games I have ever witnessesed. The bulls won it convincingly.
Jordan's comment after the game?

"Not in my house!"

The thing that is different about what the gay activists are now doing, is that they are storming churches, and trying to teach us a theology of perversion. Make no mistake about it. Dobson is just the beginning. Their thinking is that if the evengelical community will not stand firmly in the face of an attack on a man of this stature, anybody and everybody is fair game.
I am also very worried about the legislative agenda.
There will come a time possibly, for civil disobedience.
If you have weak, and pusillanimous leadership in your church, they will be coming to a neighbouhood near you...get ready!
Verne

[summer007]

Verne, "Not in my House" Don't think we'll be seeing you on 'Queer Eye for the Straight Guy' anytime soon.  Summer. p.s. They do great hair and have fabulous decorating ideas, oh yeah, and they know how to dress.( Peace)

[vernecarty]

Verne, "Not in my House" Don't think we'll be seeing you on 'Queer Eye for the Straight Guy' anytime soon.  Summer. p.s. They do great hair and have fabulous decorating ideas, oh yeah, and they know how to dress.( Peace)

"Queer Eye For The Straight Guy" was a fabulous business model. I hear the make-overs are top-notch. Just not my cup-o' tea. Their prowess in the interior design and decorating areas is unquestioed. More power to 'em. I'd have no trouble hiring a competent artiste if the need arose...just don't proselytize your lifestyle in my hearing...I am not tolerant of that...so sorry.
Verne

[moonflower2]

Their prowess in the interior design and decorating areas is unquestioed. More power to 'em. I'd have no trouble hiring a competent artiste if the need arose...just don't proselytize your lifestyle in my hearing...I am not tolerant of that...so sorry.
Verne

I agree.

[summer007]

Does anyone (Dave Sable) know what happened on 5/1-2 at Focus ? I'm guessing it may be on their site. Thanks  Summer.

[summer007]

Well they did'nt meet the Gay group with coffe and donuts. What they did was shut-down for the day and had the Sheriff on hand to arrest anyone crossing onto the property. As Christian parents of a gay son read a letter to Dobson in front of the media, they wanted to deliver it personally and were promply arrested as they were told a Focus rep would handle the letter. This is on the video in the soulforce link Dave has on page one of this thread. Dobson had no reference whatsoever to this event on his web-site. I find that somewhat strange. It's really heartbreaking in many ways. But it was definitly a protest. I'm sure after all the Prayer Dobson felt it was the thing to do, it just does'nt seem right.  Summer.